Place your bets..

[Chuck in Indiana]

The clutch on the old/new G5 works perfectly when cold. As it gets warmer, it starts to lose friction zone. Once it's hot, it's a switch.. either off or on. Maybe it's a warranty issue?   It only has 100,000 miles..
What is your best bet?  We should know tomorrow.

[nobleswood]

 

[Kiwi Dave]

I had the same issue on a 96 California 1100.  Especially with the clutch acting as a switch when warm.

Turned out it was a faulty input bearing on the gearbox.  Since you're gonna be there anyway, it would pay to check it.

[pehayes]

Once it's hot, it's a switch.. either off or on.

Pretty classic reaction from an old, high-mileage machine.  Look for any wear ridges on the transmission input spline.  Similarly, look for any wear ridges in the flywheel's interior spline teeth.  All new parts will set it right for sure!

 

Patrick Hayes
Fremont CA

[cliffrod]

Hard to diagnose such things in a clean, organized, well lit shop... 

With that said, my clutch was somewhat like that when the input hub splines were boogered. Some variation when cold.  After warm, there wasn't much or any in between engaged or disengaged..  Assumed they were worn at just the right spot. 

A new v-spline input hub to replace the old square spline hub (with new matching pressure plate) and all was happy again.

[oldbike54]

 It's broken ?

 Dusty

[Chuck in Indiana]

It's broken ?

 Dusty

A fine piece of troubleshooting, Dusty.. 

[Snowman]

The floor is too clean.
There is too much light.
The tools are well organized

These are the main problems I can see . . . . . . . 

[Groover]

Agreed, not sure how you can get any work done in that relaxing setting where nothing is in your way and all the tools you need are visible and easy to get to

Really looking forward the pics (assuming we'll see some of those) so I can learn the right steps when/if I need do this someday. My loose bet is that it's the clutch type (Sureflex), in conjunction with extremely worn-shiny and deeply grooved clutch plates. Good luck!

[Perazzimx14]

Is that a 2000's era BMW?

[wirespokes]

My 'new' T3 was exactly the same. Feathered fine cold, super grabby hot. Good splines. Replaced the Sureflex and that fixed it.

The 87 LM had slightly notchy splines and behaved differently - it was like I couldn't predict where the clutch would engage, but it wasn't particularly grabby.

My bet is on the Surflex. Probably good for drag racing or any kind of racing, but I was afraid it would cause major damage to the drive train.

[Chuck in Indiana]

Is that a 2000's era BMW?

Sacrilege.. although Guzzi was well ahead at the time. 
I haven't heard "warped intermediate plate" yet..

[Chuck in Indiana]

My 'new' T3 was exactly the same. Feathered fine cold, super grabby hot. Good splines. Replaced the Sureflex and that fixed it.

The 87 LM had slightly notchy splines and behaved differently - it was like I couldn't predict where the clutch would engage, but it wasn't particularly grabby.

My bet is on the Surflex. Probably good for drag racing or any kind of racing, but I was afraid it would cause major damage to the drive train.

That's my bet, too. Maybe combined with some of the others. With any luck at all, tomorrow should tell all.. stay tuned.

[oldbike54]

Sacrilege.. although Guzzi was well ahead at the time. 
I haven't heard "warped intermediate plate" yet..

 That falls under my diagnoses Chuckie   

 Dusty

[normzone]

While I think several of you are correct in your diagnoses, what I look forward to is pictures of the frame after he has it crabbed.

[Chuck in Indiana]

That falls under my diagnoses Chuckie   

 Dusty

Yeah, I'd say you pretty much have it covered..

[oldbike54]

Yeah, I'd say you pretty much have it covered..

 Chuck , my actual long distance diagnoses is this , the fidgelatator needs to be indexed to the push/pull modulator valve .

 Dusty

[jas67]

I think it is the Turbo Encabulator.

[Chuck in Indiana]

I think it is the Turbo Encabulator.

The TE is a fine piece of technology, as he makes abundantly clear in the video.

[bmc5733946]

I'll bet that the clutch is wonky. The Turbo Encabulator guy must have narrated at least 50% of the training films I watched in tech classes. The first time I saw the Turbo Encabulator bit must have been 1971 or so, it was attached to the end of a GM turbo 350/400 film. We must have rewound it a dozen times or more and laughed our selves stupid while trying to memorize it. Great class and great instructor, William Milbauer. Gone now but he was an inspiration and mentor to me.

Brian

[lucian]

Good luck today Chuck. One lucky T to be in such caring and competent hands. can't wait to get home tonight and get the rest of the story as My LM III exhibits similar behavior.   

[chuck peterson]

I bet you'll fix it.....

Didn't this bike blow a hole in the piston?

Maybe it's time for that automatic transmizzion? Get rid of that silly clutch thingee...

 

[larrys]

My SP exhibited the same symptoms at 30K miles. The clutch hub splines were toast. I was told that there had been a batch of soft hubs.... Well, since I already was in there, the flywheel went to Manfred Hecht for lightening.
Larry

[Chuck in Indiana]

I bet you'll fix it.....

Didn't this bike blow a hole in the piston?

Maybe it's time for that automatic transmizzion? Get rid of that silly clutch thingee...

 

Naa, that was Austin's. Don't need no steenkin automatic..

[Chuck in Indiana]

My SP exhibited the same symptoms at 30K miles. The clutch hub splines were toast. I was told that there had been a batch of soft hubs.... Well, since I already was in there, the flywheel went to Manfred Hecht for lightening.
Larry

I lightened a flywheel for the Kid back in the day, but really don't see the need on a plodder.  Flywheel condition TBD, getting a late start today..Dorcia complained the shower head squirted her in the face this morning.  Gotta keep momma happy.
I should get to it before lunch, though.

[acogoff]

     It probably needs one of Beetle's maps. But for that vintage Guzzi it is a real map of the Southern Wisconsin countryside to the store that will sell you new clutch plates.

[larrys]

I lightened a flywheel for the Kid back in the day, but really don't see the need on a plodder.  Flywheel condition TBD 

I wouldn't do it again for a cruiser or a tourer. The lighter flywheel, plus a cam and Agostini gears from Manfred, some head work, and Bub mufflers changed the whole personality of the bike. It was no longer fun at legal speeds. Sold it in '02 with 70K on it to a young guy that wanted a "vintage" sport tourer.
Larry

[Chuck in Indiana]

Ok shower head fixed, let's get into this. 
But first..
I'm an airplane mechanic. I'm also chief cook, and dirty hands and cooking aren't really a good match.  I *hate* wearing gloves. Airplanes are normally nice and clean. Automotive machinery isn't. On an old machine, no mater how well it has been maintained, it is going to be grungy when you get into the drive bits.
So.. some barrier cream that is water soluble, but *not* solvent soluble is just the ticket. Doesn't take much, but get it under your fingernails, in your cuticles, and rub it in to your hands. You'll be glad you did after working on a 100,000 mile drivetrain.

One of the things about buying an old machine from an enthusiast is you don't expect any nasty surprises. It will be well maintained. He *told* me about the grabby clutch when hot problem, but would ride it anywhere. I asked him how much he wanted, and I said ok. Didn't even start it up.
This is the first time I've had the rear drive off, and the splines and coupler are good.  Sorry for the fuzzy picture, my phone decided it wanted to focus on the shiny (not) muffler. 

Almost there..


Still need to unhook a few things, and crabbing will commence.
Twwwweeeeet!
Crap. Lunch whistle. Didn't get it crabbed before lunch.
Time to clean up..

See what I mean? Just soap and water, and all that black grunge is gone. 
Back after lunch..

[Markcarovilli]

 

waiting for the finish line.....

Mark

[blackcat]

Can we get a photo of the before washing off grunge fingers?