California 1100 or a Used Sportster for Daily Ride/Tourer?

[Castorp]

Kev m, thank you. You've touched on the real issue I wasn't getting to. I do want the bike to be my one and only, partly because of lack of garage space, partly because I like to keep things as simple as possible--so I am definitely weighing in what you're saying about the Jackal.

But I'm weighing in Dusty's and other totally postive experiences too... 

Needless to say I'd like to wind up with a postive experience bike. 

Again, beautiful bikes. Love the white on that Sporty. 

[Kev m]

Dusty makes a fair and balanced point!

thanks so much to you all for the responses and the pics!

Kev m,  to answer your question, I want to be "hands on"--and I want to very free from dependence on shops and dealerships. I started out knowing nothing, but with the ex500 I ride now I learned to do valve checks, rear suspension service, replaced all the bearings and steering stem bearing, rebuilt forks, replaced tires and chains and cables and lines, rebuilt calipers, and I'm sure I did other service items I'm forgetting--but I have never been past the valves in the engine.  I did all of that because I had pretty awful experiences at both shops and dealerships in the beginning.  I realized it was better and cheaper to do the work myself and I decided that when I got another bike it would be more a pleasure to work on than the kawi.  I heard that the guzzis were this way--simple to work on--and that's the attraction for me. The other thing is durability. I've been riding the ex500 70k and I feel like I'm still getting to know the thing in many ways, and I think: it's a shame this engine won't last three times as long. So I read about those high mileage guzzis and thought: ah ha. And I also read years ago the Common Tread piece you linked. That's one of the first things to get me interested in sportys.   What scares me about the guzzi is all the talk about uneven quality. I truly do not want something that's going to leave me stranded on the side of the road. If I can fix it on the side of the road, that's okay. And again I don't want to be dependent on specialist mechanic. Coming here for advice is fantastic, but I want to be able to do things myself most of the time. That's one of the main reasons I'm considering these two bikes. And I'm posting here in part to see if people with real experience think what I'm thinkinng about them is true. 

Oh, and I think you mentioned weather. I ride all over the Southeastern U.S.A.  And  I plan to go beyond. I will be riding in heavy rains sometimes. I will ride in very hight heat--stop and go traffic in 100 plus temps.  I also ride when it's in the 30s. Pretty cold. Would any of this be a problem for the guzzi?  I wonder if the traffic and high heat situations woudl be bad for the sporty  too.

You sound like the perfect candidate for a Guzzi. I would encourage you to seek one out and give it a try.

Tips: 2002 is fine, watch out for 03-04 Hydros, they MAY be GREAT bikes, but you would first have to confirm the recall was done and done properly (with help from this board). Before around 2002 or so the bikes were open-loop EFI which is even more simple and robust and run cooler. But there's nothing wrong with the 06-?!? Cali 1100s like the Cal-Vin, Black Eagle etc. They are great bikes too with closed-loop EFi and a bit more power too from the Breva 1100 engine internals.

Glad that one of my Common Tread pieces had an effect on you.

No, I do not believe weather or heat or traffic would be an issue EITHER on a Sporty or Cali 1100.

Good luck with the search and keep reaching out.

[s1120]

Just going by my 02 stone...  even though mine had low miles, its still age. Your going to want to plan to replace a lot of the hoses. Other then that ive done sorting...  loose bolts, a shifter linkedge ball end was bad, new tires... one caliper slide was stuck.. head bearings loose. all at about 10K mles.. It seemed to sit a long time. Easy stuff, and Guzzi's are a great bike to work on mostly. Really only big issues ive had are all from getting it running better after mods from the past owners...  Its before the hydro lifter recall of the 03-04..  I not think the 02 had the single disc clutch issue... is so if it has any miles on it it would have been delt with by now.. 

[bodine99]

 Rubber mount 1200 XL's are a real good all rounder. The pix Kev m posted of the white one is set up nice. Mag wheels easy to fix a flat on the road, dual discs. For 2 up add a detach backrest. A Corbin gunfighter & lady seat all day comfort. mid-controls with highway pegs on the engine guard give you a place to stretch the knees. 

[davevv]

I've owned both, two Californias ('98 and '03) and an '04 XL1200R (Roadster).  IMO, the major difference between the two is that the Cali is a more comfortable highway bike and the Sporty would be my preference for in town and commuting duty.  Both are great machines and their character/souls are quite similar.  If I was only going to have one bike though and rely on it for every day transportation, I'd go for the Harley simply because of the availability of support and parts.

[creaky99]

 A bike that is stone reliable, requires only minimal maintenance, easily hits 100K with no problems:  Honda CB750. Don't laugh. I bought a used '92 from my cousin with 18K on it. I put another 45K on it with the only thing done outside of normal maintenance and was a chain and sprocket set. Pic is at Yosemite.

[LowRyter]

A bike that is stone reliable, requires only minimal maintenance, easily hits 100K with no problems:  Honda CB750. Don't laugh. I bought a used '92 from my cousin with 18K on it. I put another 45K on it with the only thing done outside of normal maintenance and was a chain and sprocket set. Pic is at Yosemite.

No question that 750  Nighthawk is a great bike and deceptively fast too.  And needs no maintenance or set up.

This is a Guzzi forum and the Cali is the best all around bike for touring and commuting vs the the Honda and the Harley.  And that is objectively true in any other forum.   The caveat is that the Cali has been set up by the previous owner.  My guess if the Cali has 25k miles, it's probably set up.  Certainly the the Nighthawk is better than a Sportster.

[Kev m]

"objectively better" depends on the metrics being measured.

Few mechanical things in life are "objectively better" than everything else because people value different things.

If they didn't politics would be easy.

[LowRyter]

"objectively better" depends on the metrics being measured.

Few mechanical things in life are "objectively better" than everything else because people value different things.

If they didn't politics would be easy.

butter

 

[Kev m]

butter

 

 

Mmmmmmm butter...

It's almost as good as Bacon.

But bacon is "better". 

[LowRyter]

Mmmmmmm butter...

It's almost as good as Bacon.

But bacon is "better". 

''

Bacon on popcorn?  No wonder you're a Harley guy. 

[oldbike54]

 Chill fellas , it's hot and humid here and I am grouchy .

 Dusty

[guzzi4me]

Hopefully turning this discussion back to something helpful.......

My first Guzzi "Mistress" only left me stranded once when the gearbox/clutch had an issue. Yes I did have a dealer close by as I was on a ride in NORCAL but that was the only time she ever let me down. She is now owned by Dusty with over 150k.

My second Guzzi "Giada" was a fly and ride. Flew to Seattle and had a wonderful trip back to home via back roads. Bought her with 27k or so and then donated her as the raffle bike at Cedar Vale with just over 100k miles.

My 16 V7II "Olivia" I bought new (the only bike I ever bought new) and have been having a blast on her. She is my daily rider. The ride to work is 15 miles but the ride home could be 15-75 miles!!

I have had many Hondas in my life. CB175, CJ360, CB550, GL1000 (which I had MANY problems with) and a CB900C...probably my favorite Honda. All pretty reliable and all daily riders.

There was something about Mistress when I was looking for a bike...not looking for any particular brand....but I saw her listed on Munroe Motors San Francisco website in 2001 and went to take a look. From the first time I sat on her I knew that was the bike for me.

To this day the Guzzi sickness continues!! The V7II is by far the most "flickable" and fun bike I've ever owned. We have a lot of great roads here in NORCAL and Olivia loves every one of them.

The ease of maintenance, the fun factor and the availability of parts through our great vendors online and off is why I am such a fan of Guzzi.

There are a lot of great bikes...the hard part is finding one the "speaks" and fits YOU. For me it's Guzzi.

Ride safe and often,

Jeff

[oldbike54]

 Put your egos away or I will do it for you . Are we clear ?

 Dusty

[Kev m]

Yes Sir.

Peace brother. Ride safe. 

[oldbike54]

 Thanks

 Dusty

[Castorp]

Thanks to you all again. I am reading (and re-reading) your replies, admiring the pics, and exploring links given.(Thanks for the links to the Guzzi parts places).  I'm also reading about what each bike would involve--tire sizes and availability on the cali, belt vs shaft (I know only chains). Either bike is gonna be a new world to me--so the comments here are a great help.     

[oldbike54]

 In the end all things mechanical can be problematic . Either bike properly sorted will give good service .

 Oddly enough , the Guzzi will have a less sanitized feel to it than a modern Sportster , for all of the mythology surrounding Harley Davidson , how the MoCo has been the builder of raw motorbikes that are extremely visceral , the newer Harley Davidsons are really kinda tame . The Guzzi will feel more connected to you , more mechanical feeling , like it's something alive . The rubber mount Sportsters are reliable machines , but they won't speak to you like an old big block Moto Guzzi .

 Just my .02 ,

 Dusty

[Gappy]

These are just a few thoughts and opinions. I have been riding motorcycles since the early 70’s. And have had many makes and models. I have made friends with many people riding motorcycles. But, I have never met or have I ever seen a sportster with 100k+ on the clock. People who ride Moto Guzzi’s with 100k+ on the clock are like chicken poop. They are everywhere. The same with the HD baggers. I have a 83 flht that just got the top end done this week after 41k,but that is the nature of the Shovelhead and I won’t give that one up. To me,an awesome touring machine if you are not in a hurry. If you truely want a dependable long lasting bike with no plastic, buy an old airhead and learn how to keep it alive. My 81 r100rt has 141k on the clock, and the fun I had on it was probably by accident . I don’t ride it as much anymore, only a couple of trips a year.

If you buy a California model, and get the bugs worked out if any,the more miles you put on it the more it grows on ya. I bought my 94 Cali 1100 3 yrs ago and it is my bike of choice to ride everyday. It is snappy like a sportster, pulls some what like my Harley, and so far easier to maintain and as dependable as my BMW.

The Guzzi rallies are the best. I have always, always had a good time. Kinda like the old Honda commercial. You meet the nicest people on a Guzzi. I have never seen or been to a sportster rally, what are they like?

Last comment not fair, yes I have been to HD rallies, I don’t need or have the feeling to dress up like a pirate anymore.

[Ncdan]

My take, broken down for the simple man.

If you are a horse person:
The HD would be a foundation Quarter horse.
The MG a Tennessee Walker.

If you are a cyclist:
The HD a mountain bike.
The MG an ole Schwinn varsity.

If a musician is your thing:
HD an upright doghouse bass
MG a D25 Martin.

A carpenter:
HD, builds homes
MG, builds churches.

That’s the way I see it, broke down for a simpleton like myself.
 opinions can very without hard feelings 👍

[Rich A]

Head or heart? Fun or function? Back in 1999, I had a Sportster and was on a waiting list for a Dyna (remember when?). I took a test ride on a Guzzi, cancelled the Dyna, and never looked back.

Rich A

[LowRyter]

[Kev m]

I know 3 people with over 100k on rubbermount Sportys. Two of them with over 200k.

I'm not sure I've met IRL someone with over 100k on a single Guzzi yet. Maybe I have and just didn't know it.

[bodine99]

Thanks to you all again. I am reading (and re-reading) your replies, admiring the pics, and exploring links given.(Thanks for the links to the Guzzi parts places).  I'm also reading about what each bike would involve--tire sizes and availability on the cali, belt vs shaft (I know only chains). Either bike is gonna be a new world to me--so the comments here are a great help.   

Where in Fl.??

[oldbike54]

I know 3 people with over 100k on rubbermount Sportys. Two of them with over 200k.

I'm not sure I've met IRL someone with over 100k on a single Guzzi yet. Maybe I have and just didn't know it.

 There are at least 4 WG members that have done that , and a couple of guys that don't have pooters who have done the trick . Hell , memory says the Turnip has done the feat on 2 or 3 Guzzis .

 Dusty

[Castorp]

Bodine, Central FL, north of Orlando.

Dusty, I have heard similar arguments made for the older frame mounted Sportsters. I have not had the chance to ride one of those. I shy away thinking they might be too visceral--especially for my passenger. Hoping to find a california "just right."

Ncdan, I used to ride Tennesee Walkers growing up--as well various "mutts" with Tennesse Walker in them. So I'm getting a rough idea.   

[drdwb]

Foto that looks like a really long tongue ( thread drift).

[oldbike54]

Bodine, Central FL, north of Orlando.

Dusty, I have heard similar arguments made for the older frame mounted Sportsters. I have not had the chance to ride one of those. I shy away thinking they might be too visceral--especially for my passenger. Hoping to find a california "just right."

Ncdan, I used to ride Tennesee Walkers growing up--as well various "mutts" with Tennesse Walker in them. So I'm getting a rough idea.

 True , but a Guzzi will smooth out with RPM's , and older Sportster shakes more with speed . Once again , the new Sportsters are fine machines , just kinda boring .

 There was a couple picking up a used Bassa from our old dealer in Tulsa circa 2003 . He had several HD tattoos , she did also , which made me curious as to why they were buying the Bassa . Apparently a friend had talked him into riding his California , the guy said "At the first cloverleaf (Wichita not many curves) the decision was made for him , the Guzzi connected him to the road in a way that no Harley ever could" .

 Dusty

[TN Mark]

From an ease of ownership standpoint, it’s difficult to do better than a H-D. Dealer and aftermarket support is by far the best available. Period. The used bike selection is amazing as well.

Moto Guzzi ownership is nearly the polar opposite of a Harley. A few great  dealers with very limited aftermarket support and suitable bikes available.

Most of the other brands typically fall in between these extremes. Some of the better questions are:
what type of dealer/parts/maintenance/aftermarket support do you actually require?

Then try to base that off the particular brand and bike you select. Seeking H-D advise on a Moto Guzzi forum can be a bit tricky as you can see above. Like asking about a possible Chevy purchase on an Opel forum.

[Castorp]

A question I have about the california... It does influence my choice. Tires.   I keep reading, and I'm having a hard time figuring out what type tires these bikes use on the rear. I see spoked wheels and I think: tubes. But some seem to be tubeless spoked wheels and others are not. And for the rear tire I am finding a limited selection in that size.(bridgestone and kendas) And I'm not sure all of those will work with tubes (if indeed the bike requires tube tires).  And then I find that some of these tires even in the right size don't clear the shaft and won't work.. And then I read some people use a slighly different sized tire for various reasons... The one I hope to see this week is an 02 california stone...... Is tire choice and issue with this bike?   

Thanks again to you all.