V100 Mandello Merged Threadfest

[Clifton]

......I would buy a V85 if I wasn’t so old, my new 14 Stelvio still works for me.

I'm old and the V85 makes an excellent geezer bike!

[MLR]

The V100 is such a fantastic bike, that the clunk when going from neutral to first is such a minor niggle that it is easily forgotten.

It would be like meeting Sophia Loren and coming away from that meeting only concerned that she had one hair out of place.   

I totally agree, the V100 is bad ass. It is the kind of motorbike whether at rest or in motion is constantly whispering to your subconscious - LET'S GO! From the intake snarl of a hungry lion, to the sweet telepathic handling, all day comfort, and the looks that are like absolutely no other bike out there, it is just a joy to ride and own. Kudos to Guzzi for building such a stunningly original machine. I love mine.

[bronzestar1]

"The V100 is such a fantastic bike, that the clunk when going from neutral to first is such a minor niggle that it is easily forgotten..."

Not when you have two other bikes that don't clunk and jerk forward when going into first gear...for what this bike costs, it should have the best working transmission of all three, but instead it has the worst...that's not a "minor niggle", that's a major annoyance, and a big reason why I've only put 400 miles on it over the last 10+ months...

[MLR]

Hold it wide open and run through the gears with the quick shifter once and maybe that will change your mind. Then try knocking it down three gears while breaking hard into a corner without touching the clutch once.

[bronzestar1]

Hold it wide open and run through the gears with the quick shifter once and maybe that will change your mind. Then try knocking it down three gears while breaking hard into a corner without touching the clutch once.

One, my V100 doesn't have a quick shifter (wouldn't want one anyway, I'm old school that way).  And two, "knocking it down three gears while breaking hard into a corner without touching the clutch once" is not how I ride, nor should anyone else on the street.  On a track that would be fine.  Still doesn't resolve the first gear issue though.   

[Huzo]

Not when you have two other bikes that don't clunk and jerk forward when going into first gear...for what this bike costs, it should have the best working transmission of all three, but instead it has the worst...that's not a "minor niggle", that's a major annoyance, and a big reason why I've only put 400 miles on it over the last 10+ months...

So did you ride one before you bought it ?

[Huzo]

Hold it wide open and run through the gears with the quick shifter once and maybe that will change your mind. Then try knocking it down three gears while breaking hard into a corner without touching the clutch once.

That will do nothing to erase the fact that it crashes when you engage first gear from neutral. No one said it’s gutless, just crude.
Also without pivoting…
What is the perceived benefit in a quick shifter on a bike such as this, I’m not saying there isn’t such a benefit, just that I cannot identify it ?
Last time I checked, the ability to smoothly roll on/off the power and coordinate your control inputs when riding a big twin, was a statement of your ability and finesse..(or lack of…).

[bronzestar1]

So did you ride one before you bought it ?

Nope...but then I don't recall test riding any of the bikes I've owned over the last 40 years before I bought them...didn't test ride the V7 or Scrambler 400X before I bought them either, but the transmission in them is WAY better than the V100...

[bronzestar1]

That will do nothing to erase the fact that it crashes when you engage first gear from neutral. No one said it’s gutless, just crude.  Also without pivoting…
What is the perceived benefit in a quick shifter on a bike such as this, I’m not saying there isn’t such a benefit, just that I cannot identify it?  Last time I checked, the ability to smoothly roll on/off the power and coordinate your control inputs when riding a big twin, was a statement of your ability and finesse..(or lack of…).

To me, using a quick-shifter is akin to using a paddle shifter instead of three pedals in a manual transmission car, it's not the same...

[ridingron]

Not when you have two other bikes that don't clunk and jerk forward when going into first gear...for what this bike costs, it should have the best working transmission of all three, but instead it has the worst...that's not a "minor niggle", that's a major annoyance, and a big reason why I've only put 400 miles on it over the last 10+ months...

WOW!!! 400 miles!! What's that, 1 1/2-2 tanks of gas? It hasn't even started breaking in yet! Want me to put some miles on it to break it in?

In the overall view of bikes, the Mandello is not that expensive of a bike.

If you hate it so much, why don't you sell it?

Nope...but then I don't recall test riding any of the bikes I've owned over the last 40 years before I bought them...didn't test ride the V7 or Scrambler 400X before I bought them either, but the transmission in them is WAY better than the V100...

Don't own a Mandello but my V85 motor and transmission has smoothed out in the 9000 miles I've ridden it. Maybe be sure the clutch is adjusted correctly and ride it more? Maybe a tank a week? Or a least 1 a month?

[bronzestar1]

"WOW!!! 400 miles!! What's that, 1 1/2-2 tanks of gas? It hasn't even started breaking in yet! Want me to put some miles on it to break it in?  In the overall view of bikes, the Mandello is not that expensive of a bike.  If you hate it so much, why don't you sell it?"

Between the three bikes and two Cars & Coffee vehicles I have ('81 Lancia Zagato, '99 Jaguar XJ8 Vanden Plas), the V100 has to go thru the rotation like the others.  But with how that trans annoys me, compared to the other two bikes, seems that I've skipped its rotation quite a lot.  My V7 just hit 900 miles, and I have about 300 on the Scrambler, and both of their transmissions are buttery smooth compared to the V100, and have been more or less since I got them. 

The Mandello is considerably more expensive than my '23 V7 Stone or the '24 Scrambler 400X, by several thousand dollars.  I expect a better-quality machine for that kind of money.  Mind you, it's only that jerky clunk into first that's annoying the heck out of me, if it was from 5th to 6th I wouldn't care.  But from neutral to first happens a heck of a lot more, so the opportunity to annoy me is higher.  I wouldn't think it's the linkage, but something internal to the trans that's the reason for this jerky clunk.  'Course it may smooth out over time, and maybe with a different weight of trans fluid, who knows.

The dealer where I got my V7 and V100 also sells Triumphs.  They have a nice '25 Speed Twin 900 with the white/blue/orange tank that could be a replacement for my V100.  I'll have to contact them and see if we could work out a deal.  The V100 Navale is a novelty bike for me, since I work in Foreign Military Sales for the Air Force, and I got hooked on the factory tribute bike for the Italian Navy's F-35Bs.  If I keep it long enough for its break-in service at 1000 miles, I'll ask them about that clunk, and what can be done about it.  But given a choice, right now it's still number three on the list...   

[Huzo]

Nope...but then I don't recall test riding any of the bikes I've owned over the last 40 years before I bought them...didn't test ride the V7 or Scrambler 400X before I bought them either, but the transmission in them is WAY better than the V100...

But the point is, you would have known before you bought it.

[blackcat]

I was under the impression, maybe wrongly that the first gear clunk eventually goes away or is minimized given mileage. Or maybe one just gets use to the clunk?

I remember test riding a brand new BMW RT that had to have the worst transmission on earth and from my understanding that is the norm with old and modern BMW bikes. Anyway, when I finally got the BMW back to the dealer I was completely relieved to not have to deal with that bike so I understand your dislike of the 1st gear clunk. My Norge will occasionally clunk into first gear and that is usually from in town stop and go traffic, but I've learned to roll the bike back at stop lights before putting it in gear and there is basically no clunk. Maybe that will work on the Mandello even though they are two different transmissions, but you never know.

Anyway, with 400 miles on the bike you should just get rid of it if you aren't going to ride it.

[Huzo]

Absolutely ridiculous doing 400 miles on a bike and ditching it…
I would explore the possibility of extending the throw on the actuating lever at the clutch end, or slave cylinder to marginally separate the clutch a little more when disengaged.
In any case, I cannot conceive of getting that excited about a new bike of that level and not riding one before I went bang.
If it was a Stelvio, then I might….Just.

[Clifton]

I was under the impression, maybe wrongly that the first gear clunk eventually goes away or is minimized given mileage. Or maybe one just gets use to the clunk?

Unfortunately he'll probably have to get used to it, or sell the bike. At least that's my experience on a V100 Stelvio with around 7,000 miles now. The clunk can be stopped by starting the bike in gear and when stopped always leaving it in first with the clutch in, but this might not be so good for the throw out bearing.

What I do is after pushing my Stelvio out of the garage, start and let it warm up in neutral for a minute, get on the bike and while coasting down the grade to about 5mph then engage 1st gear, and it's completely silent with no lurch. At stop lights I leave it in 1st. If traffic will be stopped for a while I shut the bike off then restart it in first gear when time to move.

No we shouldn't have to do this and Guzzi really needs to fix this even if it involves a major transmission redesign (while they're at it, spread out the gears for a taller 6th). It's a real head scratcher how the clutch/transmission even made it past the initial development stage much less to final production. The rest of the bike is (mostly) very good which makes the clutch problem stand out even more.

[Moparnut72]

I have 7,500 miles on mine, the shift into 1st from neutral has gotten a lot better. I will never go away or be engineered out due to the wet clutch. All of the shifts are harsher than my other past and present dry clutch Guzzis. Not near as bad as the Harleys I have owned, one of them left skid marks on the garage floor. I don't test ride bikes anymore, 15 minutes will not give you any idea how the bike will be in the long term. I wouldn't have bought the Mandello if I had test ridden it, I had severe buyer's remorse, now I wouldn't trade it for anything else. Put some mileage on it, Guzzis are notorious for the long break in interval probably why they last so long, tight tolerances.
kk

[Moparnut72]

Too bad you aren't in northern California I am meeting a friend who has put a deposit on the last one available at the local dealership. He hasn't been able to test ride it due to it being at another of their stores quite a ways away. He is going to take mine for a spin. He really wanted one in your paint scheme but has settled for white. He would probably grab yours in a second.
kk

[bronzestar1]

Moparnut - ah, the wet clutch could explain everything.  So not an entirely fair comparison with the dry clutch on my V7 Stone.  However, the Scrambler 400X has a wet clutch, but being a considerably smaller single cylinder engine with chain drive, I suppose it would shift smoother than the big shaft-drive of the V100.  I rode the V100 to work today, was ok, except whenever I had to shift into first from neutral.  I suppose I could get used to it, but that's something I shouldn't have to do on a $16K bike.  I may keep it just because of all the stuff I've done to it (Agostini big bore headers, y-pipe, Mistral muffler, tinted windscreen, radiator guard, sump guard, engine guards, bar-end mirrors, tail tidy, etc).  We'll see...

Blackcat - good suggestion about rolling the bike back a little bit when stopped.  I'll give that a try on my ride home from work, see if that makes any difference.     

[ridingron]

My other bike (Honda) has a wet clutch. When the oil gets old, it starts to clunk going into first. Change the oil and filter and all is well again. Yeah, shouldn't have to change the oil at 500 miles, I get it. The oil brand and type have a lot to do with the clutch/transmission's smoothness. I'm sure it has factory oil in it but that doesn't mean it's the best oil for it. It means Guuzzi got a good deal on oil for recommending that brand. I use Amsoil and it works great for my Honda! It wasn't so great for the Suzuki I owned.

[bronzestar1]

My other bike (Honda) has a wet clutch. When the oil gets old, it starts to clunk going into first. Change the oil and filter and all is well again. Yeah, shouldn't have to change the oil at 500 miles, I get it. The oil brand and type have a lot to do with the clutch/transmission's smoothness. I'm sure it has factory oil in it but that doesn't mean it's the best oil for it. It means Guuzzi got a good deal on oil for recommending that brand. I use Amsoil and it works great for my Honda! It wasn't so great for the Suzuki I owned.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but doesn't the Guzzi transmission use actual gear oil, like the rear drive, and doesn't share the engine oil?  I know changing the weight and quantity of oil can affect "non-adjustable" front forks, wonder if changing the weight of the trans fluid could help?  I think the rear drive takes 75w140, not sure what the trans takes though...

[Turin]

Quote from: Turin on April 27, 2025, 09:12:58 PM
I finally got the chance to demo both the V100 Mandello and the Stelvio. Both were very impressive. I preferred the seating position on the Stelvio. The Mandello fet quicker with better throttle response. ( set up?) Neither bike "feels like" a Guzzi. I can get over that. I can see myself parking one in my garage someday.

Turin, both bikes have multiple throttle settings, did you note what setting each bike was on?

I put them both in sport mode. I like to give bikes the beans on a test ride.

[kingoffleece]

There has been plenty published about how the clutch is a different design.  I recall reading about how the design was "opposite" of what is more standard design.

Maybe kev can find the article.  Point was it'll lurch into first and yes, they know, and no, they say it won't do damage.

[Moparnut72]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but doesn't the Guzzi transmission use actual gear oil, like the rear drive, and doesn't share the engine oil?  I know changing the weight and quantity of oil can affect "non-adjustable" front forks, wonder if changing the weight of the trans fluid could help?  I think the rear drive takes 75w140, not sure what the trans takes though...

I am a little confused here but which bike are we talking about. The V100 transmission shares oil with the engine. If we are talking about a bike with a separate transmission a different lubricant is usually specified. When I had Harley the same oil was specified for all, Syn 3. On my last 2017 the transmission was crude the V100 is smooth in comparison. I tried several different lubricants to get smoother shifting and eventually found that BelRay Vtwin transmission oil was the best by far.
kk

[Clifton]

I have to think it would at least help if they could somehow reduce idle to 1,000-1,100 rpm.

[bronzestar1]

I am a little confused here but which bike are we talking about. The V100 transmission shares oil with the engine..."

Nope, I was referencing the V100.  Didn't Guzzis of old have separate engine / trans / rear drive fluids?  I'd have to check the OM for the recommended oil weight for the V100 (10w50?).  I've noticed, at least in the car world, a lot of manufacturers are going with a really light oil, I think the recommended weight for my '25 Nissan Frontier is 0w20!  For the longest time, in my air-cooled bikes, I usually ran 20w50.  But it seems that the newer bikes are calling for lighter / thinner oils? 

[Moparnut72]

Remember since the V100 shares the engine oil with the clutch you will need to use oil formulated for wet clutches.
kk

[ridingron]

M.G. recommends  Castrol 10W50. Engine/clutch/transmission share the same oil.

[MattP]

look lowerig the idle will work, i did this to my 95 cali  would click rite it only has 150000 miles on it since. it did live through the 07 money creek flood. any way i don,t recomend letting it idle to low.just for shifting, you can adjust idle up untell your ready to proceed, that would be the throttle.