“Innovate or die?”

[willowstreetguzziguy]

Recently watched a documentary on the Schwinn bicycle company that was started in 1895;by Ignaz Schwinn, a German born engineer in 1895 when he competed with 300 other bicycle manufacturers. He also acquired Excelsior and Henderson motorcycles but had the foresight to stop producing them in 1917 due to the great depression.

It showed how the company progressed through the 20th century and I couldn’t help notice and think of the many similarities to Harley Davidson. In the end, they we went out of business around 1989. Schwinn built their business on quality and the fact that they were USA made bicycles that were mostly sold to kids.

But they’re thinking was very shortsighted.  They almost declined the stingray bicycle, but grudgingly built it and its sales were skyrocketed. But They missed the beginning of the mountain bike craze in 1974 when Gary Fisher proposed building mountain bikes and they thought it was silly. “Who would ride bicycles in the dirt? “They also missed the BMX rage as well. (Probably for the same reason) And then in the early 70s, the 10 speed they produced were way too heavy. They didn’t see the adult fitness craze until it was too late. Trek, Specialized, Mongoose all saw the  opportunity and built their businesses on what Schwinn had missed. They thought Americans wanted quality built bicycles made in the USA, but they were wrong. America wanted bicycles that were lightweight, technically advanced and priced right.

A lot of the decisions they made remind me of Harley Davidson. Both companies focus on “their heritage” and “built in the USA”. Harley tried a different segment with the 500 and 700 cc bikes, but it was too late and then they tried the Pan-American, but they were so late to the game. Hopefully they will not continue to follow the path of Schwinn and wake up because they’re demographics is getting really old. Anyone else see the Schwinn documentary? Anyone see the similarity?

[BMCMOTO]

The book  "NO HANDS" documents the Schwinn downfall. In the book, the greed of the successive Schwinn family members is clearly documented. They had many chances to save the company by simply investing small amounts and following the advice of others. They were Schwinns and they knew better until there was nothing left of a once great name. Richard Schwinn continued to build great lightweight bicycles as WATERFORD BICYCLES until retiring recently, a year or so ago. Interviews with Richard can be found online.

Brian

[Bulldog9]

I had a NEON Green metal flake Stingray complete with the castration shifter banana seat and sissy bar....... Wore out quite a few baseball cards and close pins........... When I was in High School, I bought a Varsity Sport after saving all my $$  The summer the movie "Breaking away" came out several of us rode out to the end of Long Island, caught the ferry to CONN, and rode all the way to Newport RI before the police caught up with us and sent us home..... We were a bunch of outraged 9th graders lol. We wanted to bike up to the Ferry and fish/camp on Martha's Island or Nantucket. It was 3 nights and 4 days of freedom though. Sleeping under the stars, drinking Pepsi, cooking crabs and fish over a fire on the beach.....

Sad to see Schwinn went the way of the Dodo for REAL cycles.  In a harbinger of things to come, when that Varsity got stolen in college, I bought a Bianchi, and then another in 2007.

[BMCMOTO]

I thought maybe I should add to this thread that I am a Schwinn fan. I have been a Schwinner since 1962! First was a Typhoon for my paper route. In 1971 a 10 speed Super Sport in lemon yellow far too heavy compared to European and Japanese bikes but, they were just beginning to appear here about that time. I am still a Schwinner with a 1974 Paramount with Campagnolo components converted to city bike with upright bars etc., 1971 lemon yellow Super Sport single speed conversion (not the same bike as earlier), 1972 orange Super Sport all original, 1976? LeTour mixte frame in red converted to mountain bike bars (One Mary) etc. I also own a couple other classic brands as well, Viscount Aerospace Pro, and a Raleigh Superbe.

I'm basically a fan of anything with wheels and gears even clocks and watches.

Brian

[Dr. Enzo Toma]

Harley also took a huge misstep with tariffs in recent years, this time on the opposite side of their tariff mistakes from the 1980s. They moved production of RevMax engine bikes (Sportster, Nightster, PanAmerica) to Thailand so the bikes would be identified as made in Thailand
https://vpic.nhtsa.dot.gov/decoder/Manufacturer/Details/24197

They did this in part to avoid retaliatory tariffs against the USA from the EU for those models they want to sell internationally, and the EU brought them to court for it and ruled that the move was tariff avoidance and not economically justified.
https://infocuria.curia.europa.eu/tabs/document?source=document&text=&docid=292471&pageIndex=0&doclang=EN&mode=req&dir=&occ=first&part=1&cid=8459089

So now Harley-Davidson have bikes built in Thailand that face the same tariff rate as if they were built in the USA when sold to Europe. Moving production of a few models to another country for a reason that didn't end up working out, that's not good for shareholder value.

The difference with Harley-Davidson and Schwinn right now is that Harley still have a chance to turn things around. Artie Starrs is no Willie G. Davidson though, I don't see the conditions being present for Harley to make a move in the right direction under current leadership and as a publicly traded company.

[Vagrant]

Sears could have been what is now Amazon. Anybody remember Montgomery Wards or IBM?
Get you head out of your ass or suffocate!

[Dr. Enzo Toma]

I worked at Sears Holdings Corp in the Online Business Unit before CEO Eddie Lampert let everyone go for turning a profit there. Leadership had to step in and stop people from innovating at Sears, so I view that in a much different light as the company was intentionally bankrupted to the benefit of Eddie's ESL Investments. I don't see anyone at Harley-Davidson trying to liquidate the company for their own personal gain, instead they keep focusing on short term shareholder value instead of a longterm plan for the company, their products, their employees, their dealers, and their customers.

[Tkelly]

Schwinn bought Henderson in 1917 and dropped it in 1931,thinking the depression would last 8 more years.Pat Fitzgerald a Chicago Guzzi guy has one of the last and best model and rides it up here in WI occasionally.Scwinn made the coolest bike ever in the 1950s,the Phantom,a cruiser with balloon tires so you could ride over curbs,springer front end ,built in horn and headlight,and luggage carrier on the back so toy could transport a buddy.