Why are there so few Guzzi Dealers?

[Dimples]

I don't believe Curtis really answered the original question. There is an answer to why there are so few Moto Guzzi dealers. And another answer to the question "why people often avoid dealerships (any vehicle dealer)".

Curtis' rant actually raises the second question, but never fully addresses the first.

So, why are there so few Moto Guzzi dealers?

[Aaron D.]

You know, supporting your local business does not mean buying from them as long as they are cheaper than WalMart.

Or Amazon for that matter. Keep in mind that many of the larger businesses are using investor money to subsidize product with the direct intention of subverting your local merchant. Amazon in particular will sell items well below cost in order to get your business, and your information.

I think it may be too late, but I still prefer to spend considerably more to buy locally, even if I have to order something from a merchant rather than simply click.

Funny thing about Curtis's post- Harper and MG get all my Guzzi business because my dealer never has the parts.

[O]

I don't believe Curtis really answered the original question. There is an answer to why there are so few Moto Guzzi dealers. And another answer to the question "why people often avoid dealerships (any vehicle dealer)".

Curtis' rant actually raises the second question, but never fully addresses the first.

So, why are there so few Moto Guzzi dealers?

It's simple.  Volume.  Guzzi makes a relatively limited number of bikes a year, of which the North American market gets a small (10?) percentage of.  How many dealers can be supported by less than 1000 bikes/year total?

[jovato]

My local dealer is Seattle Moto International, so I am very fortunate.  Even so, they are a very small, unassuming shop, and I worry about them staying in business.  I simply would not have rolled the dice on guzzi, if I did not have confidence in a dealer I could at least tow a bike to within a few hours.  I don't have the time or money right now for project bikes.  I ride newer models and have services done at the dealer on the recommended schedule.  My motorcycle is no different than my car to me in that I expect to be able to go out and have it start anytime.  It is transportation that I rely on.  Now that I am in the fold, I have been won over.  I would probably risk riding a guzzi without a local dealer now, but I wouldn't ever have known that without trusting a dealer first. 

I'm curious how you guys feel about the small independent shop that specializes.  There used to be a guy in Albuquerque that specialized in old British bikes.  He was old school and used to set timing with a stethoscope.  He hated Japanese bikes, but he worked on them to fund his parts bin for the Nortons, and Triumphs he loved so dearly.  I took my old '78 Kawasaki KZ750 to him a couple of times after I had screwed something up myself.  He would scowl, but he couldn't bring himself not to give full treatment to any bike he bothered to work on.  He made that Kawi purr like a kitten each time.  When I had a wheel out of true after get bumped by a car, he re-laced the spokes by hand and and welded a new bracket for my old speedo because he knew my bike was the only transportation I had at the time.

[Scud]

 

I'm curious how you guys feel about the small independent shop that specializes.  There used to be a guy in Albuquerque that specialized in old British bikes.  He was old school and used to set timing with a stethoscope.

I like shops like that. I don't know of a Guzzi one in San Diego, but there must be... I used to take my Husqvarna to Ron Bishop (he did something like 40 consecutive Baja 1000s). He was kind of crusty and his shop was crowded with all kinds of interesting stuff. But underneath it all he was a great guy, he knew his stuff (all that race experience), and I always trusted his advice. He had a passion for Husqvarna and KTM. I miss him.

[Yukonica]

I agree. The entity selling the o-ring for $.30 made money. Not as much $ but the customer was happy!
True, Walmart captured the market, why? Inventory AND price among other things.! If I had more money than I knew what to do with I wouldn't care, but I don't. The majority putting Walmart on the map were concerned with making their few hard earned dollars go further which helps explain the "falling prices" ad campaigns. Who is mad at Walmart?, I ask myself. The business owner who sold the overpriced o-ring? BTW Harbor Freight sells oring assortments in both metric and standard for little $.

Preface: I don't have buckets of money (other than my penny jar) and I live in the 'far north' where the cost of living is higher than in urban regions. My belief is: money is useful but it isn't central to my worth.
The points you highlight are the real middle ground for the majority of working people in developed countries. But I think there are flaws inherent in the philosophy. In large part, the success of 'box' stores is based on cost saving labour practices. The very ones that create the conditions for you having to squeeze every dollar and the same ones that move production offshore which leads to further weakening of your buying power. The 'supply price' part of the equations built on volume in theory but is as often built on threats and bullying by the large chains; "we'll pay$x for the o-ring ... or we dump the entire account." Saving yourself a dollar at the cashier is possibly costing you a little piece of your community.
The crux is: we, as a culture, have turned the concept of money from a tool into a deity. We are willing to sacrifice our community and our neighbour in pursuit of an idea which has evolved from the tangible (I'll trade you this piece of gold for that iron sword) to the intangible ('corn futures have taken a hit on Wall Street today').
Therefore: I trade my cash for your future because I belief your future is linked closer to my future than you imagine.
~rant over ~  :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu

[Perazzimx14]

Funny thing about Curtis's post- Harper and MG get all my Guzzi business because my dealer never has the parts.

I do the same with the addition of Moto International to your list.

Oddly enough Harpers like all online retailers actually enable you not to support your local dealer. Fancy internet sites that offer 24/7 point and click shopping with easy checkout and quick shipping to my doorstep make it nice and easy.

I was looking for a rim strip a couple months ago. Stopped into the local Honda shop and they wanted $7.50 for one. I handed it back to him and said no thanks. MC Superstore has the same thing for $1.25. I also bought a tire machine and order tires online for steep discounts compared to what local shops charge I easily save $150 per set of tires changes compared to local rates.

I guess we're all part of the problem

 

[jackson]

Most recently, I needed a new front tire so I did some research and got my best price (delivered).   Then, I called a local motorcycle dealer (no Guzzi dealers within a couple of hours from me) and told him how much I could buy the tire for, gave him their website link to the tire for verification and asked for a price match.  They charge $15 to mount a new tire (you bring the wheel to them) if they sell you the tire and $25 if you buy the tire elsewhere.  After all was said and done, his price for the tire (mounted) was only $6 more than I could buy it for online and have this dealer mount it so I said, "close enough and I bought the tire from them.  Their initial price for this tire was around $40 higher (before adding tax and mounting.  I always attempt to give the local guys the business before buying something like this and some dealers tell you to piss off and want no part of it and others (like this one) understand that if they're going to survive, there's a big world out there (the internet) and they need to be competitive.  They don't have to match or beat an internet price but they need to come close and I'd rather give them the business.  The internet is here to stay and those who adapt will have a good chance of surviving and those who don't are likely to fail.

[Perazzimx14]

Most recently, I needed a new front tire so I did some research and got my best price (delivered).   Then, I called a local motorcycle dealer (no Guzzi dealers within a couple of hours from me) and told him how much I could buy the tire for, gave him their website link to the tire for verification and asked for a price match.  They charge $15 to mount a new tire (you bring the wheel to them) if they sell you the tire and $25 if you buy the tire elsewhere.  After all was said and done, his price for the tire (mounted) was only $6 more than I could buy it for online and have this dealer mount it so I said, "close enough and I bought the tire from them.  Their initial price for this tire was around $40 higher (before adding tax and mounting.  I always attempt to give the local guys the business before buying something like this and some dealers tell you to piss off and want no part of it and others (like this one) understand that if they're going to survive, there's a big world out there (the internet) and they need to be competitive.  They don't have to match or beat an internet price but they need to come close and I'd rather give them the business.  The internet is here to stay and those who adapt will have a good chance of surviving and those who don't are likely to fail.

The rub is "if" they will come close. Shops around here are in their own world and they obviously get folks to pay the prices. I got burned on a tire change one time. I came home and bought a tire machine form an online retailer and started rolling my own. If the local shops charged realistic prices I'd still be doing business with them. The added benefit is I get my tires changed when I want to. No making appointments or dropping off one day and picking up another. Since January I have changed no less than 50 tires for myself and friends. All money sales shops could have had if there prices were reasonable.

[jackson]

I used to own motorcycle tire changing equipment but I'm at an age and have enough health problems to the point where I have no interest in doing anything with tires except removing & re-installing the wheel.  I sold my tire equipment several years ago and don't ride enough each year to bother with owning any more tire changing equipment.  If I rode more, I would "roll my own" again.
Like you said, "if they come close" and some won't.  In the case of tires, if they won't match or come close, I'll just buy the tire and pay the extra $10 to mount it before I get hosed.

[pikipiki]

Are all Guzzi dealers listed on the official Guzzi WebSite?

E.g.

http://uk.motoguzzi.it/motoguzzi/UK/en/dealer.html

Don't see my nearest dealer which is in Loughborough

Would not be a big deal if I lived in Loughborough.
30 minutes drive each way closer than any listed dealer.

[Muzz]

As far as I know, there is no "official' dealer in Christchurch.  Went to the place that used to be a dealer for a clutch cable.  Wanted over $100NZ for it, and it had to come from Italy.  Contacted my usual supplier, Motokiwi up in Waiheke Island.  Pete emailed the price (just over half of what the former dealer wanted), I emailed back and confirmed and asked for the bank account number, and the part arrived the next day and even before his email did!  With service like that, what more could a man want.  

[ITSec]

Are all Guzzi dealers listed on the official Guzzi WebSite?

E.g. http://uk.motoguzzi.it/motoguzzi/UK/en/dealer.html

The US site gets updated (as far as the dealer list is concerned) within about 30-60 days in my experience; I'm not sure how current the EU site is.

As an interesting aside, even though I live in a major US city, it's less distance from Paris to the factory in Mandello del Lario than it is from me to my nearest dealer 

[EvanM]

I have no problem with paying a bit extra at the local dealer, but when they want $75 for the stock air filter, and 2-3 weeks to get it from New York because they will only stock valve cover gaskets for the Guzzi's, I'm gonna order online. And it's usually Harper's. I got the air filter in question to my door in 5 days, for $40 Canadian all in....

[MGPilot]

Decided to get a new full face helmet. Guzzi dealer wasn't an option, so went to a local Honda dealer. Not many customers in the store. Some of the staff standing around talking. Their price was about $50 more than the Internet. Ok. Tried helmets on from the displays until I decided which one I wanted. Staff still talking and having fun. Tried to get their attention. They said they'd be over in a minute and kept talking. I finally walked out , came home and ordered via the Internet.

Will support the Guzzi dealer as long as their prices and service seem reasonable.

[Farmer Dan]

I made the 2 hour drive to the nearest Moto Guzzi dealer once.  He took one look at my Eldorado and said "We can't help you, nice bike though". He didn't ask what I needed?  I called them couple weeks ago and asked if they had a 2015 Eldorado that I could take for a test drive.  They said they haven't got one in yet.  I've gotten more parts from the local Harley Davidson shop than I have any where else.  As much as I hate their bikes I do give them credit for having a good dealer network.  But then if you sell that many bikes per year you'd better have a lot of places to get them fixed.

[azguzzirep]

Q) How does one make a small fortune selling Moto Guzzi?

A) Start with a large one.

That's how it was explained to me once.

Tom

[Rough Edge racing]

 Interesting....As mentioned ,Harper's ask to you to buy from your local dealer but he has an online store... that could take business from your local dealer... 

[HoboRob]

Much of the discussion has been premised on the assumption that dealers are unable to compete on price. Some posters have said that they would buy from their dealer even when the cost is greater, while others have noted that there are circumstances in which they would buy a less expensive product elsewhere.

However, the impetus for Curtis' original post was a comment I made in another thread: "My kingdom for an o-ring!" In that thread, Curtis asked why I would not go to my local Moto Guzzi dealer to purchase an o-ring. My reply was as follows:

"Yes, I suppose it's odd that I didn't. I would turn to the dealer if I had no luck elsewhere, but I thought my prospects would be better if I just went to an industrial o-ring supplier. I suppose I was afraid that the dealer wouldn't stock such a small item, and that their recourse would be to have an o-ring shipped from Italy!"

Curtis then launched this thread by purporting to quote me, but he did not indicate that he had surrepticiously edited my comment by deleting the reference to an o-ring.

Well, context is everything. If it was indeed my comment that spurred Curtis into action, then it should be known that, in fact, price never entered into the equation. It just never occurred to me that it would be likely that my local Moto Guzzi dealer would stock o-rings. I would be very surprised if they did. As for price, well I paid about $30.00 to have a bag of o-rings hot couriered to me so that I would be able to ride. It's not like I went to the industrial supplier because they're "cheaper", like Walmart...

The real issue is service, not price. I know this is a matter of personal choice, but when I have a Moto Guzzi issue, I'll go to my local, knowledgeable Moto Guzzi dealer. But when I have an o-ring issue? Well, is Curtis really arguing that Moto Guzzi dealers should stock o-rings? Is he implicitly suggesting that dealers should go out of business if they fail to stock these o-rings? Or is he arguing that I should suspend my riding season so that I can support my local dealer by giving them the opportunity to generate the revenue that will come from ordering, receiving and selling an o-ring? Ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous.

Finally, the most important element of "service" is trust. Earlier in this thread, I invited Curtis to comment on why he thought it would be appropriate to surreptitiously edit a comment attributed to another "anonymous" poster by eliminating key context. If he has done so somewhere, I've missed it.

[Two Checks]

Interesting....As mentioned ,Harper's ask to you to buy from your local dealer but he has an online store... that could take business from your local dealer... 

Curtis IS my local dealer. He's near KC, I'm near STL.

[Xlratr]

Much of the discussion has been premised on the assumption that dealers are unable to compete on price. Some posters have said ..........

Nicely written! And all very reasonable.
John

[canuguzzi]

Interesting....As mentioned ,Harper's ask to you to buy from your local dealer but he has an online store... that could take business from your local dealer... 

How so? If you local shop isn't selling MG motorcycles then that also affects his online store sales. A stagnant buyer population hurts all dealers, brick and mortar and online.

[Rough Edge racing]

How so? If you local shop isn't selling MG motorcycles then that also affects his online store sales. A stagnant buyer population hurts all dealers, brick and mortar and online.

I'm assuming the reference to a local dealer is also a Guzzi dealer.

[canuguzzi]

I'm assuming the reference to a local dealer is also a Guzzi dealer.

Correct.

The problem though is the lack of models of MGs people want to buy. We can say MG evolves and offers great designs until pigs fly. The market speaks and the fact is that the typical motorcycle buyer doesn't want what is being offered by MG. Then, without MG doing more than hosting a website and praying for an honorable mention in a cycle magazine wenhave what we have, a sparse dealership network.

It doesn't matter what we say, it only matters what customers buying new motorcycles say and they are saying that they don't by and large want what MG is selling.

[Xlratr]

It doesn't matter what we say, it only matters what customers buying new motorcycles say and they are saying that they don't by and large want what MG is selling.

Or maybe they do, and they just don't know it.
Marketing and advertising and infrastructure are all very expensive, and you need a mother company willing to tolerate a minimum 5 year (heavily) negative bottom line to get the message out there. Doesn't happen very often in today's corporate environment.
John

[canuguzzi]

Or maybe they do, and they just don't know it.
Marketing and advertising and infrastructure are all very expensive, and you need a mother company willing to tolerate a minimum 5 year (heavily) negative bottom line to get the message out there. Doesn't happen very often in today's corporate environment.
John

Thousands of companies say otherwise. You hear this when a company doesn't execute or can't meet the demands of a market, somehow no one knows they need what the company is selling.

Yes, they know.  MG isn't a startup and advertising pays off quickly if the product being sold appeals to those looking to buy. The guy selling the stupid "fix me stick" manages to buy ads, MG can't? I'm not trying to say anything other than not selling a lot of something when others do so is not an indicator that customers don't know what they need or want, it is an indicator that they do and you aren't selling it.

[ITSec]

Thousands of companies say otherwise. You hear this when a company doesn't execute or can't meet the demands of a market, somehow no one knows they need what the company is selling.

Yes, they know.  MG isn't a startup and advertising pays off quickly if the product being sold appeals to those looking to buy. The guy selling the stupid "fix me stick" manages to buy ads, MG can't? I'm not trying to say anything other than not selling a lot of something when others do so is not an indicator that customers don't know what they need or want, it is an indicator that they do and you aren't selling it.

Or perhaps, based on the comments on brand knowledge and advertising, that the customers have an idea of what they want, and don't even know that the company has an offering of that kind. I can't count the times I've bumped into people who had heard of Moto Guzzi, but had no idea they made bikes in the style of the Norge or Stelvio. I really don't think MG has failed to build something that is reasonably attractive to a significant part of the market - but that more often, they have hidden their benefits beneath a bushel-basket.

[Triple Jim]

I can't count the times I've bumped into people who had heard of Moto Guzzi, but had no idea they made bikes in the style of the Norge or Stelvio.

I agree with that.  I find that a  majority of motorcycle types who know the name Moto Guzzi have the image of the early models in their heads, and consider all of them, new or old, to be slow, heavy, clunky, 4-speed motorcycles with tractor engines in them.

[bad Chad]

Preface: I don't have buckets of money (other than my penny jar) and I live in the 'far north' where the cost of living is higher than in urban regions. My belief is: money is useful but it isn't central to my worth.
The points you highlight are the real middle ground for the majority of working people in developed countries. But I think there are flaws inherent in the philosophy. In large part, the success off 'box' stores is based on cost saving labour practices. The very ones that create the conditions for you having to squeeze every dollar and the same ones that move production offshore which leads to further weakening of your buying power. The 'supply price' part of the equations built on volume in theory but is as often built on threats and bullying by the large chains; "we'll pay$x for the o-ring ... or we dump the entire account." Saving yourself a dollar at the cashier is possibly costing you a little piece of your community.
The crux is: we, as a culture, have turned the concept of money from a tool into a deity. We are willing to sacrifice our community and our neighbour in pursuit of an idea which has evolved from the tangible (I'll trade you this piece of gold for that iron sword) to the intangible ('corn futures have taken a hit on Wall Street today').
Therefore: I trade my cash for your future because I belief your future is linked closer to my future than you imagine.
~rant over ~  :Beating_A_Dead_Hors e_by_liviu

Very well stated, I completely agree with Yuk.

[lucian]

I also feel fortunate to be only two hours away from a terrific MG dealer. They have been super to deal with, most importantly they are there to fully support what they sell, no bs. They seem to have all the necessary service parts on hand for modern guzzis, and they have no problem shipping if you can't make the trip. A great bunch of people, and when they say they will call you back, they do,every time. I  can highly recommend Seacoast Sport cycle,in Derry N.H. to anyone searching for a dealer who has there poo together.  dave