V7ii Stornello shaft spline lube

[helipic]

Hi all, I just got a Stornello last month.  Coming up to 600mi first service, I am thinking to take the rear end apart and lube the drive shaft splines.  Before dissecting into the brand new bike, I would like to hear from members here if there is anything I need to look out for to avoid screw ups.  Do they come well greased from factory already?  Many thanks in advance.

[SmithSwede]

Splines on my 2013 V7 Stone were dry.   I say lube them up.  I use GuardDog 525 with 30% moly.

[Chuck in Indiana]

The most tenacious stuff I've ever found..


Wurth SIG 3000 spline grease, 14oz tube. High quality, extreme pressure/sling off resistant.

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

The most tenacious stuff I've ever found..


Wurth SIG 3000 spline grease, 14oz tube. High quality, extreme pressure/sling off resistant.

This ^^^ . http://www.mgcycle.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=23&products_id=1914

[ramarren]

Hmm. I'm coming up on my break-in service on Tuesday. Perhaps I'll ask them to check the drive shaft splined coupling and lube it if necessary...

[malik]

And as they have the same arrangement as the other V7's (& small locks), every time you have the rear wheel off to change the tyre, take off the final drive to drain the collected water & re-grease the splines.

Only just did so with the '14 Special, but this time found a thick brown oily goo in there. Nasty seemly stuff. Indicative of a problem? Oil from the final drive squeezing past the seal? More investigation is needed and questions will be asked in appropriate places. Watch this space. BTW this bike has now done 96,000km.

Mal

[sign216]

I wrote a guide for spline lube on the older pre-2013 models.  It might have a few tips for you. 

Double click on the photos to get the text.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/sign216/albums/72157625569987011

[Chuck in Indiana]

^^^^^^ Very nicely done, as usual, Sign..  attaboy. 

[sign216]

^^^^^^ Very nicely done, as usual, Sign..  attaboy. 

Thanks Chuck.  Unfortunately for this guide, I don't have any "assistant" photos. 
I must correct that.

Joe

[pyoungbl]

Sign, thanks for the photos.  I see that the splines are back by the final drive, not at the output shaft like on the Stelvio.  That's nice to know....much less to take apart.

[Tom]

You don't want the chocolate milkshake coming out and coating your bike.  Any grease is good.  Marine type better.  When you go to the factory museum.  Punch Guido in the face for me. 

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Sign, thanks for the photos.  I see that the splines are back by the final drive, not at the output shaft like on the Stelvio.  That's nice to know....much less to take apart.

There are splines at the output shaft where the u-joint slips on as well. Wouldn't hurt to grease those, even though the swingarm needs to come off to do it.

[Chuck in Indiana]

There are splines at the output shaft where the u-joint slips on as well. Wouldn't hurt to grease those, even though the swingarm needs to come off to do it.

Yep, it's really no big deal.

Small blocks, like Earth Girls.. are easy.

 

[helipic]

I just reviewed the parts schematics; there is a small spring within the spline sleeve pushing against the driveshaft.  What is the function of the spring?  Is the reassembly straight forward?

[SmithSwede]

Malik:

About three times I pulled the swingarm and drained out nasty brown water.   What is worse, I would drain the final drive oil, and it would come out “water contaminated green.”    A build up of water in the swingarm will just sit next to the final drive seal and eventually work its way in.

I pulled the swingarm, removed the circlip and worked silicon goop all there.  Result was a waterproof swingarm.

Problem was it was also airtight, and the rubber boot would swell up as the air heated up and pressurized.

So I drilled a very small hole in the rubber bellows to bleed the air.    Result?  Past 40,000 miles and no water in swingarm, and no green contaminated final drive oil.

I think it’s worth doing.   

[Chuck in Indiana]

I just reviewed the parts schematics; there is a small spring within the spline sleeve pushing against the driveshaft.  What is the function of the spring?  Is the reassembly straight forward?

The spring keeps the coupler in the right location. Yes, straight forward.. just don't put the spring on the wrong side. 

[malik]

Malik:

About three times I pulled the swingarm and drained out nasty brown water.   What is worse, I would drain the final drive oil, and it would come out �water contaminated green.�    A build up of water in the swingarm will just sit next to the final drive seal and eventually work its way in.

I pulled the swingarm, removed the circlip and worked silicon goop all there.  Result was a waterproof swingarm.

Problem was it was also airtight, and the rubber boot would swell up as the air heated up and pressurized.

So I drilled a very small hole in the rubber bellows to bleed the air.    Result?  Past 40,000 miles and no water in swingarm, and no green contaminated final drive oil.

I think it�s worth doing.

Interesting.

On the V7C, I positioned the break in the boot's circling to the top & applied silicone around it. There has been some water inside the swingarm cover, but significantly less and there was still grease on the splines. I had thought about drilling a hole at the lowest point of the swingarm & tapping it to fit a drain  nipple. Theoretically the water should drain out.

Then just recently, I took the bevel box off the V7S and a muddy mix of oil, water & rust poured out. Ugly stuff. Unsure at this stage whether the oil's coming through the seal from the final drive, or from the gearbox. A bit of a worry. I'll drain both to see if I can't ascertain the shortfall over the last 5,000km since the last service. The V7S does not have silicone on the boot.

When I took apart the swingarm on the 23,000km Breva, the break in the boot's circling was facing up and the drive shaft was pristine though dry & no sign that any water had ever been in there (and no sign that the bike had ever been in rain, either).

[pyoungbl]

I'll add just a bit to all the wisdom already offered.  Today I took the time to grease the splines on my V7.  It's less a PITA than the Stelvio...but not much.  Two things really took my time.  Getting the darn boot back on the tranny housing and then putting the rear wheel back on the final drive.  The latter has convinced me that I'll never attempt to fix a flat on this bike while on the road.  There is no way in  hell that I will be able to get the rear wheel off, break the bead, fix the tube, and put it all back together while sitting in a ditch.

With that said I'll mention a couple points that other small block newbees (like me) might find interesting. 

no rust but also no grease on the tranny end

same on the final drive end
This is not to say that the sky is falling!  If you have the time and inclination it's a 1.5 to 2 hour job.  You'll need a couple large wrenches and a 27mm socket.  The other bits are common hand tools.

If you are a big block guy like me you will be surprised at the swingarm axle.  There are two of these stub axles, on on each side.  They screw into the swingarm and stick out into sealed roller bearings in the tranny case.  As I recall (and did) you are supposed to make sure the stubs stick out the same distance (from the swingarm body) on each side.

With all that said, I really do like my small block V7.  Every machine has it's 'character' points and the rear wheel mounting system is what I'll call character.  No wonder a shop charged me 1 hour labor to put on a new tire.  That was a real bargain!

[Kiwi_Roy]

As I said on another post the factory consider the shipping grease is enough for the bearings.


Sent from my shoe phone!

[Chuck in Indiana]

As I recall (and did) you are supposed to make sure the stubs stick out the same distance (from the swingarm body) on each side.

That is true with the big blocks, but..
*Unless they are different* from the old small blocks, those screws are just turned in until they contact the bearings. Location of the swing arm is by a big washer between the swing arm and transmission case on the D side. The big nuts are just lock nuts once this is done.
If you have the Photoblockit embed fix on your browser, all of this is detailed with pix on page 9 of the Lario Rehab thread on the "bike builds and rebuilds" area.

[helipic]

This always puzzles me about the re-installation of the swing arm, how do you keep the small nut from turning while tightening the big 27mm nut to 50nm torque?  or do I just tighten up the big nut without holding the small nut stationary?

[pyoungbl]

I did not worry about the stub axle turning when I tightened the 27mm nut.  That big nut is (as Chuck mentioned) just there to lock the stub axle in place so it does not back out.  There is a plug in the center of each 27mm nut so maybe you can insert the correct allen key to keep it in place.

[Tom]

Loops....you use a needle nose pliers or snap ring pliers.

[malik]

The swingarm is aligned by screwing the LHS pin in until it just touches, then the RHS (with its spacer) until it just touches. Then the covering nuts go on & are torqued down. I'm continually impressed by the simplicity & elegance of this design.

[Chuck in Indiana]

^^^^
The small block was developed after the big block, and they learned a fair amount. Many things are an improvement in design.

[SmithSwede]

Go small blocks !

[OlofE]

As a result of reading this I just had my 7500 mile V7 Stornello -16 in for shaft splines lubing. Much needed. The mechanic said that the splines were dry, only grease was a small smear on the shaft end. No damage however. Splines now embedded in LiquiMoly LM47 MoS2 grease and I feel much better. Thanks!

[malik]

Good for another 20,000km, or whenever it is you next replace the rear tyre. Well done.

[helipic]

Just did my 600 mi service with spline lube job.  I removed the entire swing arm and the drive shaft just to make sure everything is properly lubricated.  Contrary to what I read about bone dry splines on V7's, my Stornello's final drive coupling splines were lubricated with grease from the factory, thank you Luigi.  However, the u-joint spline and the trans output shaft were bone dry.  The disassembly was pretty straight forward.  I removed pretty much everything attached to the rear swing arm to ease the wheel removal and installation.  The hardest part of this entire process was the installation of the wheel while keeping the cush-rubber pieces in place. Reattaching the rubber boot to the transmission was a piece of cake.  I would like to thank you all here for the inputs which made this job less challenging.

[malik]

Those cush rubbers can be annoying. Sometimes the wheel goes straight onto the hub with no problems, and sometimes it doesn't. (Leads me to suspect that there is an "Italian" secret technique involved). When it doesn't just slip on, no matter what you do, walk away for a bit, have a drink, chat with someone, whatever. Often when you come back to it, it works easily & quickly.

I usually have the centre stand up on a couple of blocks of wood, so that the wheel clears the mudguard easily. That also tends the give a little more room to move in there. If I take away the left hand block so that the bike is leaning to the left, (or do it on the sidestand), that (sometimes) helps the cush rubbers stay in their cups.

Usually it's not a problem, all goes well. Sometimes though it's a nightmare. Note that if the cush rubbers are worn, or twisted they seem more likely to catch the tangs of the hub & pop out midstream. I keep a spare set of rubbers on hand in case.