V85 TT Merged Threadfest

[Tusayan]

Wow, that was creative.

[pete roper]

Really?  Thats a bit bizarre, eh? It appears that somebody else is "slightly odd" to me.

I've travelled enough (I hold three passports, and speak three languages) and done enough with motorcycles to understand what has lasting value to the market, and what is cheap, transient nonsense...  and by the way IMO that includes your over dramatized silliness.

Do you still remember, Pete, your assertion that Piaggio should move Guzzi to Monza?

I suggest a rinse for the sand.

I remember well suggesting that moving the manufacture of Guzzis to a green field site would be a sensible thing to do rather than continuing to build them in a crumbling, tween-wars fascist edifice in the centre of a small medieval town with ridiculously limited infrastructure and access, yes. I still think it would be the right thing to do.

[Kev m]

Being one of those apparently rare individuals who bought their Guzzi as a new bike, I have to say that this one has me interested.  I'd like more than 200 mile range - in fact, 200 miles is sort of my lower limit for mileage on a tank of fuel - with reserve to go.

My desire is for a lightish weight, light off-road duty motorcycle.  Something what will handle gravel and hard packed dirt well and can fall over without costing $1000 in parts to fix.  I want to be able to ride to the aircraft crash sites in the Mojave desert, Scotty's Castle in Death Valley, Bodie Ghost Town (last 7 miles are gravel and dirt), and some of the neat places in Utah, without worrying about the plastic on the Norge, the weight of the Norge, or the silly idea of taking my Goldwing to those places.

I don't plan to spend a year in South America riding single track, so something like this sounds good to me.  The F800GS is too expensive and has the anti-theft antenna issue to worry about.  The other real options to me are a Ural or CSC RX-3 for around $4K (which probably makes the most sense, but I still like the idea of the V85).

As for the mileage figures quoted back a few pages - a quick look at Fuelly.com shows what people are reporting on the V7 series.  Most folks are getting mid-40s - be they V7, V7II or V7III in whatever trim.  There are currently no V9s listed.

jdg

Mid 40's sounds low. I tend to get lower mileage than a lot of people report on bikes but even I never get less than high 40's (48+) and usually get low 50's on my MkI V7.

[oldbike54]

 Chill fellas, enough with the personal insults.

 Dusty

[Aaron D.]

How so?

Besides the lack of ABS, rider modes etc, the single TB means no syncing. The belt is low maintenance and can be changed at the roadside in 30 minutes or less. One instrument, single disc, and even though a firt-run bike only a leaking stator seal and thermostat housing (replaced immediately) are the only warranty issues on mine. Fewer with my wife's.

[Aaron D.]

Carlo Guzzi died in 1964, my first visit there was in 1989 and there was very clearly an identity to the place and the product that was present there until probably 2002 or so.  In 2004 things started to change, although with a great big 1921 factory, statue of Carlo Guzzi, and V8 sculpture there it's a bit hard to erase. I've  been there about ten times in all and if you haven't been and are open to changing an uninformed opiion, I'd suggest going. 

Piaggio is not Moto Guzzi, and Italy is not corporate America (or corporate Germany either for that matter, in reference to the Ducati/VW comment above.  My newest of four Ducatis is a 2001, with good reason).  I might consider a new MV.

By corporate identity, I mean the machines themselves. Nice to hear and read about factories and the individuals at them, but it means little to me on the road.

[fossil]

What do I not understand here? Five and a half years ago I bought my white V7 Stone new because it was exactly the bike I wanted. Because it was basically hand-build in an old, crumbling factory in a medieval North Italian town. Because it was a basically a bike from the seventies of the last century, but with a makeover of the engine from Aprilia. Because it sounded good, looked good, had a metal tank but electronic fuel injection and cats, was light, fun to ride and seldom. First I wanted a Harley Sportster Roadster 883, but the Guzzi ticked more boxes. Today I still love the bike. It is in the process of getting a fork upgrade (Mupo emulators), and, yes, the gearbox needs and gets repair, but still...

And the V85? I really look forward to that bike. In the moment nothing competes directly (in this it resembles the Himalayan), And Guzzi has clearly stated that more models with the new engine will follow.

What they do is following a simple strategy: earn money with a model (V7) by steadily improving it, try to get into markets where there is not too many competition (V9), and even try to attack the big boys (1400 vs all the big American and Japanese cruisers). But with an own recipe. And now: expanding in a logical way into markets where they could be successful. But still with the own recipe.

I cannot see that Piaggio makes something bad. They give Guzzi the chance to grow. And up to now the riders of the new bikes like their bikes, often really love them (like me myself). 

[oldbike54]

 Good post Fossil 

 Dusty

[rdbandkab]

    fossil

Not sure if this color combo was posted.
Can't wait to see the "road" versions.

[Trialsman]

Got to the gate about five to three in the rain. Museum is good but I was disappointed they would not give out info. I worked on three at the Guzzi building but found out more at Agostini. He was tight lipped as well. Looks like they built twenty test bikes and they do have plans to build a crossover pipe to replace the cat. Seemed to indicate dealers would be notified on specs next month with delivery by January. I had a portion of a brochure translated which indicated tube tires. Reluctantly he said seat heir was about two inches below his belt line. Other than that they stonewalled me. I guess we continue to wait.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Trialsman]

Translated from a brochure at museum office.

GRINDOSA BRAKING 1. The one-piece saddle is quite low, in the portion dedicated to the pilot, in order to easily touch the ground: it is wide and well shaped, but we would like it a little more tapered in the front area. The solid steel luggage rack integrates the handles. 2. The tailpipe has a classic shape with an oval section (to reduce lateral dimensions) and emits a very civil sound. Pure too much. 3. The generous front braking system uses two 320 mm floating discs combined with radial calipers, all from Brembo. Two-piston floating caliper and fixed disc at the rear. The spoke circles require the use of inner tubes. 4. On the aluminum side plates on fixed the swingarm pivot are also connected to the rider's pedals (with removable rubber) and passenger. Adjustable brake and shift pads with an eccentric.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rhodan]

Though they were tight-lipped, well sleuthed!

[Muzz]

  fossil

Not sure if this color combo was posted.
Can't wait to see the "road" versions.

Would I buy one?  Hell yeah.

Have I the money to buy one?  Hell no.

[Huzo]

Good post Fossil 

 Dusty

Yes Dusty.
That really did say it all didn't it.
So many people here (including me), spend far too much time decrying other people's choices.
I resolve to stop doing it...!

[Tusayan]

And the V85? I really look forward to that bike. In the moment nothing competes directly (in this it resembles the Himalayan), And Guzzi has clearly stated that more models with the new engine will follow.

What they do is following a simple strategy: earn money with a model (V7) by steadily improving it, try to get into markets where there is not too many competition (V9), and even try to attack the big boys (1400 vs all the big American and Japanese cruisers). But with an own recipe. And now: expanding in a logical way into markets where they could be successful. But still with the own recipe.

I cannot see that Piaggio makes something bad. They give Guzzi the chance to grow. And up to now the riders of the new bikes like their bikes, often really love them (like me myself).

What you're describing is essentially what I suggested as the right path, and in fact the path that Piaggio has belatedly pursued, because its the only one that makes any sense.  Their approach is a little awkward still, kitschy retro etc, but improving,  The interesting thing is that with little initial investment, Aprilia and then Piaggio could have (and should have) followed this path in 2004-2005. Now, thirteen years later maybe, maybe they understand they can only sell Guzzis strengths and values, not erase Guzzis values and conceitedly force Guzzi badged Aprilia/Piaggios into the market in a vain attempt to make Piaggio into BMW, and gratify their corporate ego.  By failing miserably in that pursuit, maybe they have learned something.

Ducati did the same thing under government mismanagement in the 70s, with the block headed parallel twins, 860GT etc. that were their lowest point, but then by introduction of the SL Pantah, increasing production of SS's etc and attracting more enthusiastic and passionate attention, they eventually came under Cagiva management and away they went...

[jGuz]

Is anyone else turned off by the digital displays?  I've always liked analog speedos and tachos - they just fit the nature of motorcycles.  Motorcycles are an escape from the sterility of contemporary life - I want to look away from screens when I'm on my bike. 

I just hope the bike is simple and solid.  It doesn't need anything fancy, it just needs to work.

[Tusayan]

Is anyone else turned off by the digital displays?  I've always liked analog speedos and tachos - they just fit the nature of motorcycles.  Motorcycles are an escape from the sterility of contemporary life - I want to look away from screens when I'm on my bike. 

I just hope the bike is simple and solid.  It doesn't need anything fancy, it just needs to work.

Agreed.  Digital displays are cheap and effective, but a lot like being in the office at work for many people.  I think an esthetic that would work for the Guzzi concept is minimized digital displays, i.e. small and compact, giving the impression of being easy to remove and replace if needed.  Like a Jeep or 2018 version of the original GS instrument pod, and not like a late model BMW (or Gold Wing  )

[JohninVT]

I like analog gauges but emissions regulations mean fuel injection and on board software to manage it.  On board software means occasional error codes and that requires a digital readout or interface to diagnose or reset.  We don't all want ABS and TC and cruise control but the majority of riders today do want those things.  That's especially true with the ADV crowd.  It's impossible without a digital dash.         

[Murray]

We don't all want ABS and TC and cruise control but the majority of riders today do want those things.  That's especially true with the ADV crowd.  It's impossible without a digital dash.       

Once you have electronic throttle and ABS/ wheel rotation sensors the rest is simply additional lines of code so the cost of manufacture is negligible.

[TimmyTheHog]

I like analog gauges but emissions regulations mean fuel injection and on board software to manage it.  On board software means occasional error codes and that requires a digital readout or interface to diagnose or reset.  We don't all want ABS and TC and cruise control but the majority of riders today do want those things.  That's especially true with the ADV crowd.  It's impossible without a digital dash.         

I have a feeling that this is exactly it...

Not a fan of the digital layout, but it isn't the worst one I have seen...at least it got color? *shrug*...

Here is a video from the Intermot 2018

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRWs5ITiStE

So far it looks good!...

[rdbandkab]

I wonder what that bike would look like with a low front fender.....

[Gustavo]

I like analog gauges but emissions regulations mean fuel injection and on board software to manage it.  On board software means occasional error codes and that requires a digital readout or interface to diagnose or reset.  We don't all want ABS and TC and cruise control but the majority of riders today do want those things.  That's especially true with the ADV crowd.  It's impossible without a digital dash.       

I wholeheartedly agree, but there are some arguments to be made for an analog (looking, at least) tach.  I have ridden some bikes with these all digital dashes (where the tach is usually a bar graph, and not always in a "natural" location and layout) and it's very hard to see what the engine is doing at a glance.

I admit that at least this layout Aprilia/MG are using is more natural than is found on some Yamahas and Hondas lately



But you could so something like this, show all the digital info you want and still have a "normal" tach:



Gustavo

[PJPR01]

Funny that part of the dash is in Italian - Pioggia...it's raining, not to be confused with Piaggio, and the rest of the dash is in English.  Odd that they are not synched...

[timax]

Thats quite funny.
I would assume if your on a motorbike and its raining you wouldnt need to read it on the dash.
Or is this a rain mode or forecast?

[Kev m]

Thats quite funny.
I would assume if your on a motorbike and its raining you wouldnt need to read it on the dash.
Or is this a rain mode or forecast?

It's rain mode, less aggressive throttle, more aggressive TC.

[F-22]

Since it's got such a big screen and still those classic dashboard lights at the sides for neutral, turn signals and other stuff, it would be really cool if it could show up satnav.

Edit: actually, looking at the photo, there is some map icon at the top, so it probably will do something like that...

[Zoom Zoom]

Funny that part of the dash is in Italian - Pioggia...it's raining, not to be confused with Piaggio, and the rest of the dash is in English.  Odd that they are not synched...

That's normal. Same thing on my 1400. Veloce, Tourismo, and Pioggia. Measurements are all in USA, not metric.

John Henry

[Gustavo]

If you want to get mellow, you don't need a tach.
 

That's probably true.  But, I don't think anybody has ever described my riding style as mellow.  I am often very thankful for those rev limiters...   


I just saw this, from the new Indian FTR1200:


Seems like a good compromise between having an all digital dash and putting the info in an easy to read format.

Gustavo

[Gustavo]

That's normal. Same thing on my 1400. Veloce, Tourismo, and Pioggia. Measurements are all in USA, not metric.

John Henry

There is no setting to change the language?     That's pretty surprising.  Yes, I can see how that plays on the Italian character of the bike/brand, but it's almost trivial to do when you are programming the display. 

Is there a user selectable setting to change from IP (inch-pound or Imperial) to metric?

Gustavo

[Clancy]

Top left is a fuel tank level indicator, though it's probably just determined by calculated mileage.