Martins Followup and Butting Heads with a Ford Dually

[antmanbee]

An unfortunate thing happened in Martins parking lot. A big Ford quadcab dually backed into my Jackal and did some damage but I am not sure how much.
The rear bumper contacted the Jackal front fender (I had put on a 2003 cal aluminum fender made out of plastic) and shattered it and pushed the bike back a few feet damaging the side stand. I think it may have damaged the front wheel a bit too. When the wheel is spun there is about 1/8" side to side and also up and down movement. I think I feel a slight pogoing while riding it.
The bike was not knocked over but I think the truck bumper pushed down hard on the tire while it was being pushed back.




Forks appear to be alright but it is hard to tell.
Any suggestions on how to assess damage and what it will cost? Can the steel wheel be trued and fixed. How much is acceptable for out of round/true?

There are a couple more pictures in the other Martins thread. 1st and 3rd picture after the Morini 3 1/2.

[normzone]

Had something similar happen to my Eldo last century and the handling was affected - good luck to you and the Jackal.

[chuck peterson]

That could be a lot worse than it looks...i would start with "the bike is totaled"...until proven otherwise....

Think of the twisting motion put on the frame by pushing on the front wheel while on the side stand...forks tweaked? Steering head twisted? Frame bent? Painted rippled off an opened weld? Just the front rim replacement is like $400-$600 at a dealer?.....if bent then replace

[antmanbee]

That could be a lot worse than it looks...i would start with "the bike is totaled"...until proven otherwise....

Think of the twisting motion put on the frame by pushing on the front wheel while on the side stand...forks tweaked? Steering head twisted? Frame bent? Painted rippled off an opened weld? Just the front rim replacement is like $400-$600 at a dealer?.....if bent then replace

Wow, I didn't want to hear that. There was not even a scratch on the rest of the bike. Just the destroyed fender and the wheel that is slightly tweaked. The bars appear to go lock to lock normally.

I was hoping that there was a procedure for checking for tweaked forks/steering head.

The bike tracks straight but it feels like there is a slight up and down from the front.

[LowRyter]

When the forks are tweaked, you might just loosen up the fasteners and let it unbind until it settles straight.  Then make sure it's square and bolt it back up.

[antmanbee]

That's what I always do when I have the forks off for any work.

Is there any way short of disassembling the forks and rolling the tubes on a flat surface to check for straightness?

[John A]

I'm not sure of how you could check the fork tubes without dissasembling them but it's important for you to trust they are good. I wanted to say check the bottom steering head bearing housing for deformity, that's where the get messed up on a front end hit.

[RinkRat II]

When the forks are tweaked, you might just loosen up the fasteners and let it unbind until it settles straight.  Then make sure it's square and bolt it back up.

  After this^^^ a quick check of  wheel alignment with a straightedge or fluorescent tube will give a indication if something's tweaked. Most shop manuals will give frame dimensions and as some disassembly will be required.

      Paul B

[twowings]

Do they not allow for the cost of alignment check/repair in the estimate?

[antmanbee]

  After this^^^ a quick check of  wheel alignment with a straightedge or fluorescent tube will give a indication if something's tweaked. Most shop manuals will give frame dimensions and as some disassembly will be required.

      Paul B

I assume you mean a straight edge from the back tire to the front along the edge?

I'm not sure of how you could check the fork tubes without dissasembling them but it's important for you to trust they are good. I wanted to say check the bottom steering head bearing housing for deformity, that's where the get messed up on a front end hit.

With the front wheel off the ground, turning the bars lock to lock feels normal, but I will check it again. I would assume that if the bottom bearing housing was deformed it would not feel right.

[RinkRat II]

I assume you mean a straight edge from the back tire to the front along the edge?

   Yes, and here's a link to explain  https://www.cycleworld.com/2014/02/21/ask-kevin-whats-the-best-way-to-check-motorcycle-wheel-alignment


        Paul B

[PeteS]

Was the bike in gear when it was parked? If not I doubt the frame was damaged.
Put the bike on the center stand and put a jack under the pan and lift the front wheel off the ground. Spin the wheel to see if its been bent.
Then take a a flat plate of metal or glass that spans the fork legs above the sliders and see if it rocks.
If so loosen the triple clamps, remove the jack and pump the forks. Tighten the triple clamps and check the forks again with your flat plate. If it doesn't rock the forks are OK.

Pete

[antmanbee]

Was the bike in gear when it was parked? If not I doubt the frame was damaged.
Put the bike on the center stand and put a jack under the pan and lift the front wheel off the ground. Spin the wheel to see if its been bent.
Then take a a flat plate of metal or glass that spans the fork legs above the sliders and see if it rocks.
If so loosen the triple clamps, remove the jack and pump the forks. Tighten the triple clamps and check the forks again with your flat plate. If it doesn't rock the forks are OK.

Pete

I did jack up the bike under the pan and spin the front wheel. It looks like about 1/8 inch up and down and also about 1/8 side to side.
Would that be enough out of round for the slight up and down motion I feel in the handlebars?
 
The bike was in neutral when pushed back.

Good idea on the flat plate between the fork tubes.

Thanks

[John A]

A carefull visual inspection of the lower bearing area should tell you if it is deformed.

[M0T0Geezer]

Sorry your nice bike was assaulted by a fawtawss dually. 

I have another gripe about them too: Those things always spread sand/gravel into a tight right curve ('specially in the mountains) when their passenger-side rear tires scrub into the gravelly shoulder.  I've been behind them many times and watched it happen. 

You Brits and others in places that drive on the left will have to watch out for the tight left hand curves.

'Geezer

[BrotherJim]

Was this a no fault situation on account of it happening in a parking lot?  That would be aggravating.

[ccoli]

I've bought a few wrecked EVs over the years,. Some had major frame damage but, believe it or not,  straight fork tubes. Those 45mm tubes are apparently quite tough. I'd inspect the steering neck area closely for any cracked paint.  If the bike handling is good, your probably ok. Replacementwheel should be available, as many folks have modified their Jackal to use EV rims, and may have the original oneson a shelf. Titanium fender could be tough time find.
Sorry to hear about your misfortune. Best wishes. Hope to see you next year.

[jfpcan]

Just wondering if there was any news for you was everything fixed or was it a right off.

[Guzzi Gal]

jfpcan, welcome to WG!

[Chuck in Indiana]

I know this is an old thread, but

Would that be enough out of round for the slight up and down motion I feel in the handlebars?

Yes. 1/8" out or round or out of track is totally unacceptable.

[Sasquatch Jim]

 Make him buy you a new bike.

[antmanbee]

Well it has not gone as good as I hoped. The people that backed into me, initially wanted to pay me direct and not go through their insurance company. I have no objection to this and I just want to get the bike back on the road.
I wanted to be careful and make sure there was not some hidden damage that would come back to bite me so I stopped by the dealer in Daytona to see if I could get an estimate but they wanted $170 to look at it. I declined for a couple of reasons. Mainly I think that is outrageous for an estimate that would likely lead to some work. I also would be libel for the charge if I was not able to be reimbursed for it.
I have looked at it pretty carefully myself and think a fender, wheel and kickstand would resolve it. All that adds up quickly with painting the fender and labor to take the wheel and tire off and shipping to a place that can straighten and true it.
So this whole process has been strung along now for a couple months plus. Then after sparse contact towards the end of April and during May, they tell me to contact their insurance company.
I think it was going to cost more than they had anticipated and more than i thought too.
I have contacted the insurance company and I am waiting while they look into it. It is more complicated than usual because they are Canadian and the accident happened in Florida.
I just hope somebody comes through and makes this right. 

[twowings]

I'm constantly amazed that the very same people who just ran into you JUST HAPPEN to have a friend/brother-in-law/etc who does body work and so no need to call the police to investigate, right??? 

Usually turns out they lack insurance, money, honesty, and any sense of responsibility...

The last guy that hit me from behind had no insurance, no license, no job, was driving a stolen van with lifted plates, was running a chop-shop from his residence, unpaid moving violations, AND was trying to leave town when the investigating officer went to talk to him...

This guy had the gall to assure me that his 'friend' in the bodywork business would 'fix' my brand-new 2012 Mazda 3 hatchback 'just fine'...who needs to bother with cops, eh? Yeah, right 

[jfpcan]

Nothing to do with being Canadian I had someone run into me we exchange insurance info my insurance did all the work. As long as everyone has insurance it’s no problem.

[Sasquatch Jim]

 You should have called the cops when it happened.  That way you would know if he has insurance and who they are.

[antmanbee]

They had insurance and gave me the info, name and address etc.
I took a few pictures and there were plenty of witnesses.
I think it just got more expensive and involved than anticipated.
Although I think they should have called their own insurance company and requested to remedy this after they decided not to handle it themselves rather than having me do it.

[jfpcan]

Did they have damage to there vehicle if not they would not contact there insurance you have to contact your insurance and your insurance would take care of it.  I know this cause I worked in the insurance industry for years. Whois your insurance carrier and why are they not taking care of this for you it’s very simple.

[Two Checks]

They damaged your vehicle they should have their insurance cover it. Your company neednt be involved.

[jfpcan]

Insurance companies don’t usually deal with individuals they prefer you call your insurance then they send out a appraiser then they contact the other party’s insurance that way they keep thing on the up and up to many ripoffs going on. As a agent for years I have seen it all. I hope both parties have insurance most Canadians cannot even get plates without insurance.

[twowheeladdict]

You should have called the cops when it happened.  That way you would know if he has insurance and who they are.

Unfortunately, this is not an accurate statement.  Anyone can have a 'valid' insurance card because the stupid companies send cards but if you don't pay the bill the insurance is no good.  My buddy got hit, the guy showed the cops his insurance card and my buddy got the information and they parted ways.  My buddy's insurance had to fix his bike.