U/J Carrier bearing collapse

[izzug otom]

When installing the 20 x 44 and 22 x 50 crosses that I buy from my source, I've had to reuse the original circlips - the supplied circlips are always too thick. So, 22 x 49 may be a perfect fit, I don't know for sure since I've never tried it.

Thanks Charlie, I've found an Italian manufacturer 'Della Concordia' who stock the 22mm x 50.2mm part number CR748 listed simply as Moto Guzzi, along with the 22mm x 49mm part number CR63 listed as Moto Guzzi Spada 900 and Fiat Sedici. Having said that, I tried to find that spec for the Fiat Sedici, and couldn't find that size, but a variety of others

Are you aware of differences in the u joint between the Spada 900 and other big block bikes?

I can't find anything on the Spada 900, only the 1000, but in Gutsibits UK they list one U joint and says fits 850/1000's all models, Cali 1100 etc, and can't find anything different for a Sp 900. In the 'Which Model' section of the parts search, it only lists the Spada 3, which lists as the same spec fully assembled 10 spline Cardan joint, as for the Cali 1100.

I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and see. I'm concerned about not getting it right, as the consequences could obviously be grim, but I'd be surprised if Guzzi used a very slightly different spec on just one particular model like that.
 
Why is life so confusing, me poor old head's stewed from searching the interweb   

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Thanks Charlie, I've found an Italian manufacturer 'Della Concordia' who stock the 22mm x 50.2mm part number CR748 listed simply as Moto Guzzi, along with the 22mm x 49mm part number CR63 listed as Moto Guzzi Spada 900 and Fiat Sedici. Having said that, I tried to find that spec for the Fiat Sedici, and couldn't find that size, but a variety of others

Are you aware of differences in the u joint between the Spada 900 and other big block bikes?

I can't find anything on the Spada 900, only the 1000, but in Gutsibits UK they list one U joint and says fits 850/1000's all models, Cali 1100 etc, and can't find anything different for a Sp 900. In the 'Which Model' section of the parts search, it only lists the Spada 3, which lists as the same spec fully assembled 10 spline Cardan joint, as for the Cali 1100.

I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and see. I'm concerned about not getting it right, as the consequences could obviously be grim, but I'd be surprised if Guzzi used a very slightly different spec on just one particular model like that.
 
Why is life so confusing, me poor old head's stewed from searching the interweb   

No such model as a "Spada 900" that I'm aware of. My experience is mostly limited to early big blocks - up to around '90 - but I would doubt any one model would have a different u-joint cross size, except possibly the early Spine-frames (Daytona, Centauro, 1100 Sport).

I'll see if I can find a used disk brake u-joint in my stash and measure the cross width, maybe that will provide a definitive answer.

[izzug otom]

No such model as a "Spada 900" that I'm aware of. My experience is mostly limited to early big blocks - up to around '90 - but I would doubt any one model would have a different u-joint cross size, except possibly the early Spine-frames (Daytona, Centauro, 1100 Sport).

I'll see if I can find a used disk brake u-joint in my stash and measure the cross width, maybe that will provide a definitive answer.

Yes, I spent some time trying to find the rarer than rare Spada 900 after seeing that listed for the u j 

If that'd be possible that'd be grand. If it's a lot of trouble though, please don't worry, as I do hope to get mine out this evening, fingers crossed, now I've got a couple of hours to try and unseize the two offending nuts 'n bolts. 

[tris]

This any help?

https://www.driveshaftparts.co.uk/index.php?route=product/category&path=90

Plus This Old Tractir has a section on Tonti drive shafts

https://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_tonti.html

[izzug otom]

This any help?

https://www.driveshaftparts.co.uk/index.php?route=product/category&path=90

Thanks but no, I've already checked them out, nearest the have is a 22 x 54.

[tris]

OK, how about this then https://www.amazon.co.uk/22x50-Drive-Shaft-Cross-7020-290120/dp/B08K7C9FH2

Plus looking at the old tractor site the carrier bearing is a 6206-2RS

That's a bog standard bearing with 2 rubber seals try here https://www.bearingboys.co.uk/SKF-Ball-Bearings/62062RS1-SKF-Sealed-Ball-Bearing-30mm-x-62mm-x-16mm-1898-p

I worked for NSK for 11 months before they closed the business around me

[Chuck in Indiana]

The world could generally do with a heavy sprinkling of such attitude and approach to life

Attaboy..

[Antietam Classic Cycle]

Yes, I spent some time trying to find the rarer than rare Spada 900 after seeing that listed for the u j 

If that'd be possible that'd be grand. If it's a lot of trouble though, please don't worry, as I do hope to get mine out this evening, fingers crossed, now I've got a couple of hours to try and unseize the two offending nuts 'n bolts. 

Measured one - the cross width is 50.17 mm, so it's possible the 50.2 mm cross may be correct. This was just a sample of one, so measure yours to make sure.

[izzug otom]

OK, how about this then https://www.amazon.co.uk/22x50-Drive-Shaft-Cross-7020-290120/dp/B08K7C9FH2

Plus looking at the old tractor site the carrier bearing is a 6206-2RS

That's a bog standard bearing with 2 rubber seals try here https://www.bearingboys.co.uk/SKF-Ball-Bearings/62062RS1-SKF-Sealed-Ball-Bearing-30mm-x-62mm-x-16mm-1898-p

I worked for NSK for 11 months before they closed the business around me

Ah thanks mate, I spent a good while looking, but they're shipped direct from China, virtually all of them have grease nipples on them. The one that I found, quite expensive, I'm not sure if it has a nipple. It didn't show one, but then again they didn't show the circlips either.

Also it's the end of the month delivery, some of them mid to late next month   

My uncle worked in a ball bearing factory in Newark most of his life, RHP, later became NSK

The bog standard bearing, would you mean like this one in the photos?   



 It's a good job I caught it when I did, I reckon there's only a few thousand miles left in them

I banged my hands up a few times, getting more leverage using the second ring spanner over the open end of another fixed over the seized nut, same as how I cracked my elbow a couple of times on the swing arm as I was crouched under the rear mudguard where I could get a direct pull on the spanners. It's time I got a lift to work at a more reasonable height, although I was wrenching that hard, I'd have probably levered it the whole thing over,

Swearing could be heard throughout my neighbourhood. Swearing at my own stupidity though, or at least cursing my luck, which I was pushing  I stopped being angry with inanimate objects a long time ago     

I can't find my circlip pliers, I don't know where they are, so haven't attempted to remove the crosses. Quite remarkably, despite them having scuff marks, the u j's don't look to have gone at all. What looked like a pin was probably just a sharp shard from the chewed up carrier bearing They feel smooth in all directions, no rough spots, and feel like they've got that lightish smooth resistance that you'd associate with being greasy.

They must've taken a right hammering though, I can't believe the state of that carrier bearing! And I can't believe I didn't notice it, or least recognise it. I had heard the clanking noise a couple of times when pulling it backwards in my yard to leave. I was puzzled as to why the centre stand would snap up like that, when it'd been parked on the side stand. I checked it, and of course all was ok, doh! 

Lesson learnt here I think 

I don't wanna even think about how I'm going to budge the inner and outer housing of the carrier bearing. I'll take a look at it today.

Measured one - the cross width is 50.17 mm, so it's possible the 50.2 mm cross may be correct. This was just a sample of one, so measure yours to make sure.

Thanks Charlie, I'll see about getting them out and measured today and report back. I'm feeling some muscles that I'd forgotten I had today.

[tris]

The bog standard bearing, would you mean like this one in the photos?   

I conclude that that 6206 has deconstructed itself!

Plus I think that heat, a lot of it, and a big daddy vice are in your stars to get that apart

Good Luck

PS if your Uncle worked for RHP/NSK you owe it to yourself not to buy a SKF bearing 

[izzug otom]

The 22 x 49mm u/j cross and it's association with the imaginary Spada 900 seems to be a theme across different manufacturers. This is from GNK.



I'm totally confused by this. They don't list other, real Guzzis, but it seems a few companies list these as Sp 900

I can't find a 22 x 50 or a 22 x 50.2 that's a sealed for life joint, just nippled for greasing. The only sealed option seems to be the 22 x 49.

Except for these that I've found in Germany, but made by Elbe in Italy, who apparently supply Guzzi. They're a bit pricey, but it might be a case of 'if needs, must'.
https://hmb-moto.de/Universal-joint-repair-kit-T3-LM-1000

I'll contact them and ask what the measurements are. And how much the shipping is.

Tris, unfortunately I don't have the tools or a decent vice, or heat, I'm totally ill equipped for the task. I was thinking maybe it's time to buy a dremel, but it wouldn't be easy to get in there and take pieces out of it without damaging the swing arm. Not quite sure what to do. I can't imagine penetrating oil would travel far enough to benefit the situation either 
 

[Tom H]

The only reason I mentioned a dremel is that it is a small tool that you can fit in many places and use various wire wheels, stones, cut off wheels ect.. They can be handy to have around a shop.

You might want to see if there is a machine shop, motorcycle shop in your area that can remove the remains of the carrier bearing from the swing arm and the U joint. An inside/blind bearing puller might work for the swing arm, but not cheap.

Normally if the bearing is intact, I would use a rod/bar of the right size, put the large open end on the floor, slide the bar through the swing arm and whack the bar with a large hammer. Pops 'em right out.

REMEMBER, there is a C clip that holds the carrier bearing into the swing arm.

Now the dremel part. You could use it with a cut off wheel to remove the bit on the U joint by cutting a slice into it, or maybe a few slices. The bit in the swing arm would be a bit more difficult, but you would cut a slit at an angle. I did this to get a steering bearing out of my R75/5. I had a slide hammer blind bearing puller, but no way to hold the frame rock steady to get the slide hammer to break it free. Also no way to use a pull jaw set that came with the tool.

With the price and hassle of changing out the U joint crosses, and seeing how rough looking the yokes are, why not spend a few bucks more and get a new complete bearing?

Hope this helps a bit,
Tom

[izzug otom]

You might want to see if there is a machine shop, motorcycle shop in your area that can remove the remains of the carrier bearing from the swing arm and the U joint. An inside/blind bearing puller might work for the swing arm, but not cheap.

Yes, I'm going to see if a local engineering firm can help out. I'm not sure if there's going to be any of the outer race for a press to push on, is that shiny circle of worn steel not the end of the swing arm I don't know how easily it'll be to get sliced through the bearing casing, only, or how many cut off disks I'd shatter trying, but I am thinking that may be my only option. Cut what I can then hammer and chisel.

I'm just hoping the swing arm itself isn't damaged?

REMEMBER, there is a C clip that holds the carrier bearing into the swing arm.

Could you point to it in the photo please  . . . Ha ha.

I had read of this, but thanks, you wouldn't know it by looking alone, and could have caused considerable wasted effort and, no doubt, numerous profanities 

I hope I'll be able to distinguish it when I clean it up a bit.

With the price and hassle of changing out the U joint crosses, and seeing how rough looking the yokes are, why not spend a few bucks more and get a new complete bearing.

I'll reserve my judgement on this until I've cleaned them up properly and inspected, but I don't think there'll be a great deal of damage to the yokes themselves, maybe a few burrs to get rid of, and some scuff marks.

The actual crosses feel really ok, much to my surprise. If everything was ok in there, and I was just checking them, I'd think they felt fine. There's no play detectable at all, though that might be down to any play being taken up by the compacted crud, but they run smoothly through all their travel in all directions, so if the bearings in the crosses held up to that abuse, I doubt the yokes would be too damaged.

Of course, I know what a hammering they've been taking, so naturally, I'm going to replace them. If I go for the high quality cardan joint, it's 3 or 4 times cheaper if I buy the costlier, but Guzzi quality, crosses from Germany.

If I really had money to burn, I'd probably be tempted to get a tidy used replacement swing arm, a new U/J joint, and save myself some serious effort, but I've got more effort in me, than I have cash in the bank, so rebuilding my old U/J is just the natural way forward for me. It'll still be a good bit cheaper than an economy complete u/j kit, but I'll know I'll have the best quality crosses installed, and I'll know, with some much appreciated help from folks here, that the job has been done well.

I am all good with not being flush financially, I mean it's a life choice I made, not misfortune, none of that being destroyed by a money grabbing ex or the likes. I'm not doing the "my woes, poor me" thing  , but I don't want to appear too tight to do what's required, I just need to try and work within the confines of my budget. Using my yokes and replacing with the same crosses used by Guzzi, is the best quality, at the lowest cost. It's just the way my mind has to work 

I used to have a good successful business buying restoring and selling antique furniture, but I've also always been a gigging musician. Using a lot of very heavy sanding gear on stripped pine furniture, all the rage back then, most of it shipped off to the US, the vibrations were starting to give me numbness in my hands, they'd get swollen up, affecting my guitar playing. So I had the choice of carrying on making good money, at the expense of losing the ability to play music, or not. I chose not.

It's not a romantic, or rock 'n roll lifestyle to boast of, travelling up, down and across the country, doing solo gigs, often in some god forsaken places, carting a full sound system and all the necessary gear to play the gig, get paid, pack it all away, travel up to 3 1/2 hours home, unload the gear, and repeat, anon. It could be quite grim, but I never could stand working for 'the man' , and it wasn't really feasible to hold a job down when it was often dawn by the time I'd be getting home.

Playing more locally is much more fun though 



1 gigabike =1000 megabikes, no?

I make a bit of money from photography, which I studied long before digital, in the early 80's, but only through print sales of mostly street and social documentary photography.

I am extremely wealthy though, it's just not in monetary terms, is all.   



 

[chuck peterson]

Ebay has handfuls of Cali swingarms most under $100….most are about $75

[Tom H]

Did not mean to sound like I was telling you to blow some cash on a new U joint. Just there are times that repairing something is about the same cost a getting a replacement.

If the crosses are as smooth as you say. Once cleaned up and double checked, you may want to just it as is.

The carrier bearing. A shop may be able to weld something to it and then drive it out. For the R75 I mentioned, your supposed to weld a few beads to the cup and then use the beads to drive it out.

Ahh,,, The life of a Rock Star

Tom

[izzug otom]

Ebay has handfuls of Cali swingarms most under $100….most are about $75

So I've noticed Chuck  I was amazed just how many were listed. There was one the other day complete with drive shaft and u/j, for £95 here in the uk. I can't see it now, so assume that sold. It probably would have been worth it for the shaft and swing arm, as an engineer shop will charge me for dealing with my mess, and I'm not really sure if the swing arm is going to be all good where the carrier bearing seats.

Did not mean to sound like I was telling you to blow some cash on a new U joint. Just there are times that repairing something is about the same cost a getting a replacement.

Aw Gawd, is that how I came across? I'm sorry Tom. I think the point you made was a fair one, and probably the most sensible, for most people, in most situations. My brain only seems normal to me I think  I'm adhd into the red, I don't medicate for it, as that'd feel like medicating part of myself away, and the last thing I need is an addiction to speed, in one form or another, which was the option.

Stimulants, even heaps of caffeine, have the opposite affect on many adhd'rs compared to others, where it has a calming affect. One of the common traits is to over explain yourself, and was more concerned about being seen as tight fisted and stubborn about not spending for the sake of it. I'm certainly not offended by your comment, that is what most people would do I imagine, and most people I know who prat around on motorcycles, have plenty of money to spend on them.

So I was explaining, overly  . The typed word is not quite the same as talking in person with facial expressions, and vocal intonation, but I appreciate all for chipping in here, regardless of whether something said works for me or not 

If the crosses are as smooth as you say. Once cleaned up and double checked, you may want to just it as is.

Mmm, I think, knowing the chaos and hammer they've had, I'd probably spend too much of my ride time stressing about them. It's not like you can keep peeking to keep a check on it.

The carrier bearing. A shop may be able to weld something to it and then drive it out. For the R75 I mentioned, your supposed to weld a few beads to the cup and then use the beads to drive it out.

Ah yes, that makes a lot of sense. I use to be able to use a really cool, well equipped, motorcycle workshop, for several years, only a mile or so from home. That was so useful. My friend left the area for a woman he met, which was my loss, her gain, lol. . . . I didn't put up a fight 

Ahh,,, The life of a Rock Star

Hahaha, no mate, I'm really not, but I could sing you a bunch of songs, with some cool pickin 'n slide guitar 

[izzug otom]

What do people do for cleaning the crap out of the final drive output seal? Lots of crevices with bits of crud that's been flung in there. I'm assuming it's not so good to flood the area with water and detergent etc.





I'm taking a look at this mess today too. I know it looks really wet on the gear lever spline area, but I don't think it's coming from there, and there's no dripping at all underneath. I'm pretty sure it's from the airbox vent out, which I noticed a few weeks ago when I did see a few drips.




On inspection I saw that the vent pipe that dumps the oil collected in the airbox had folded on itself, and was proper kinked, preventing oil from being released. As a result the oil started leaking from around the spigot's connection to the box.

It seemed a bit weird, as it wouldn't have been under pressure, and hence not being forced out, but it'd found the path of least resistance, and the spigot is on the loose side. However, I cut the kinked section of the pipe and refitted it, and  there's been not a drop on the floor since. I think there will probably be some slight seepage unless I can tighten the fit.




Can anyone tell me if there's a nut on the inside of the box, that's accessible when the lid and air filter is removed, or is it threaded directly into the box itself?

I'll clean up the mess and inspect, to be sure there is no seepage from the g.box, and clutch arm, but I'm fairly confident that the culprit for all of the mess here was due to the pipe that drains the oil collected in the airbox.

[John A]

Use mineral spirits for cleaning off grease and oil. You don’t want water in those areas. Mineral spirits is cheap ( Guzzi content) and can be put in a spray can, available at hardware stores around the oil cans except they have a spray nozzle. Don’t expect them to know anything about them or even if they have one.

[dguzzi]

  WD40 or similar with a toothbrush or similar. Looks like you have a few leaky areas?

[izzug otom]

Use mineral spirits for cleaning off grease and oil. You don’t want water in those areas. Mineral spirits is cheap ( Guzzi content) and can be put in a spray can, available at hardware stores around the oil cans except they have a spray nozzle. Don’t expect them to know anything about them or even if they have one.

Thanks John, I have some in my cupboards. I've used it on some of the casing, but not sure I like the idea of a degreasent around seals and bearings incase it seeps in there. . . . Maybe I'm over thinking this?

  WD40 or similar with a toothbrush or similar. Looks like you have a few leaky areas?

Thanks dguzzi, yes I guess WD40 should be ok on rubber, but after librally spraying the shock mounts over 3 days, the rubber had gone a bit squidgy and soft, but only on outer surface though.

I'll reserve final judgement, but my suspicion is of just the one leak from the airbox. This is on account of there being no drips at all under my bike since I unkinked the oil collector vent, and tightened the loose spigot best I could.

If I cant seal the spigot, I'll degrease thoroughly and try some steel putty around it and see if that does the trick. The thing is, that vent is directly above the gear and clutch spindles. Just going on the basis that there's been no drip, drip, drip on the floor for the past few weeks, since noticing the kinked oil collector overflow.

I cleaned around gear and clutch spindles late last night, I'm going to spend a bit of time out there shortly, but I guess they would mostly leak only at running temperatures. So it'll perhaps be a 'time will tell' thing.

I'll fit the hose of Henry the Hoover around the output shaft to suck whatever crap out that I can before cleaning up.

I think I might have a crack at changing brake fluid in both res's this week if I'm stuck a couple of days awaiting the uj crosses from Germany, or if an engineer has my swing arm and drive shaft etc. I did strip and service all 3 callipers early last year as a couple were sticking , actually, it might have been the year before (it's a short term memory thing  ), and although I flushed plenty of fluid through, I didn't replace it all.

Fork oil change is probably well due too.

Cheers, Mart

[Pescatore]

I don't know if it's sold in UK, but I use Simple Green.  It dissolves most grease and grime and it's safe on plastic and rubber.
And it's cheap. And it smells good.
If needed, I rinse with a water mist spray, not pressure.   Then blow it dry.
You might want to cover the output and clutch piston areas. Just make sure it's completely dry.
Time to pull out used tooth brushes you saved for no reason.

[Moparnut72]

I use kerosene to clean grease off of hard to reach areas of my bike. It is a recommended solvent for cleaning o-ring bike chains. Gets the contaminated lubricant off but doesn't damage the rubber o-rings.
kk

[izzug otom]

I use kerosene to clean grease off of hard to reach areas of my bike. It is a recommended solvent for cleaning o-ring bike chains. Gets the contaminated lubricant off but doesn't damage the rubber o-rings.
kk

Thanks, I'll bear that in mind another time.

[izzug otom]

I don't know if it's sold in UK, but I use Simple Green.  It dissolves most grease and grime and it's safe on plastic and rubber.
And it's cheap. And it smells good.
If needed, I rinse with a water mist spray, not pressure.   Then blow it dry.
You might want to cover the output and clutch piston areas. Just make sure it's completely dry.
Time to pull out used tooth brushes you saved for no reason.

Thanks, another thing to bear in mind another time. . . . Haha, yes of course I have old toothbrushes around, still with battery life, so they'll jig around a bit too 

[John A]

Thanks John, I have some in my cupboards. I've used it on some of the casing, but not sure I like the idea of a degreasent around seals and bearings incase it seeps in there. . . . Maybe I'm over thinking this?

Cheers, Mart

No, not over thinking at all. You don’t want to wash any grease out of the bearing so I just wipe those areas. The nice thing about mineral spirits is it doesn’t attack rubber and paint as a general rule.

[izzug otom]

Well I cleaned up the crud from around rear of the motor, the gbox casing etc, made it look a bit more respectable. There's no fresh oil showing anywhere, but of course that was likely leak or not, til it goes out for a ride etc.




I've found a local engineering co that should be able to remove the seized carrier bearing races from the uj and swing arm housing, and arranged to take them in tmro. I tried with this puller arrangement on the shaft, but I only have woodworking vices set up on a woodworking bench (nothing oily allowed), so I had no grip and leverage.



facebook public photos


I thought about sticking it on the output shaft, grabbing a tight grip of a spanner on the puller bolt, and with the engine running, flick it into 1st gear, as I wouldn't want it spinning too fast, and maybe that'd crack its seal. But then I wasn't really sure which way it'd spin so . . . c'mon now, I had you going there for a minute 

I've ordered all I'll need to complete the job, or at least I think I have. Please let me know if there's anything else obvious that I've left out.

The two uj crosses - in transit from Germany

Carrier bearing - SKF 6206-2RS1

Carrier bearing circlip - 62mm Internal Circlip

O-ring for bevel box to swing arm - O-ring x2 58.42 int dia 2.62 cross section

Shaft external circlip - 18mm external circlip

2 x hose clips for sealing the uj gaiter

2 wheel bearings - SKF 6204-2RS1 Although there's no play detectable, they both sound a bit gratey when I run them round with my finger. They've not been changed in the 9 yrs I've had the bike, so it'd be a bit daft to leave them out whilst

So hopefully, all being well with the engineering co, in removing the seized carrier bearing races, I'll be able to proceed relatively unhindered.

Is it important that I mark the position of the Uj yokes, in relation to each other, or with it being the same measurements on all sides of the crosses, is that irrelevant?

I couldn't find my circlip pliers anywhere, so I bought a cheap set, which arrive this yesterday evening, so I'll finally get around to unclipping them and pressing them out today.

I have to say, the crosses really don't appear to be in bad shape considering, they're free and smooth in all directions, and I can't detect any roughness in them, and not the slightest bit of free sloppiness anywhere. If anything, although I can detect no free play, they may be a bit too light in their designed travel, as I'd imagine them to have a bit more resistance from the grease, but I have no experience whatsoever to go on, so whether what I imagine to be the case has any accuracy, I've actually got no real clue.

One more thing, can anyone tell me what this plastic coating on the inside of the drive side of the rear wheel is all about? Is it important?





image uploader


As you can see it's coming away, and is very brittle and just flakes. It's leaving the white powdery alloy corrosion. It seems a bit of a crazy thing to have inside the wheel. Is it supposed to be some form of a seal maybe? 

[izzug otom]

No, not over thinking at all. You don’t want to wash any grease out of the bearing so I just wipe those areas. The nice thing about mineral spirits is it doesn’t attack rubber and paint as a general rule.

Whoops, I'm an idiot, doh! 

I did use a bit to swill out some stuff that was stuck in there, not much, but a bit and used a toothbrush and then tissue to mop up any wetness. I hope that's going to be ok 

[Frenchfrog]

Looks like powdercoat to me

[izzug otom]

Looks like powdercoat to me

It seems its doing it's best to return to powder. I don't quite see the purpose on the internal like that, but I guess there must be an explanation.

By the looks of the surface of the alloy, it'll need treating with something, either a tough paint or I don't know, just a film of grease maybe?

I'm sure I won't be the first to ever come across this on a Guzzi wheel  , so hopefully someone will chip in and inform my puzzled mind   

[Frenchfrog]

Like I said, powdercoat. My snowflake wheels were done with it and after a good few years it started to flake in a similar way to your photo. The corrosion gets under it and then it separates the two.And it's a real bugger to get off  where it's still holding on too !!